View Full Version : Details of your Boat
I am very upset because I have discovered that the details of my boat are published on the internet. It seems that if your boat is registered with either the EA or British waterways then they can give the details of your boat to anybody who applies under the Freedom of information act. A sad man who runs a website about boating has applied to EA and BW for this information and published it on his own site. What do people think?
Welcome to the Forum.
Before you get overwhelmed with opinion, views, rants, obsessions, advice, counsel, recommendations, and anything between, it would be useful if you could give a few clues about yourself in the bio. Not everything, but enough to start a small mine of speculation would be a start.
The answers to the question you put may depend on several factors: the information has been provided under the FOI act, and EA and other contributors have presumably considered the Data Protection Act, European Human Rights, and similar legislation.
Are you concerned that personal details (i.e. of living person) are being given out ? Can we have the URL of the site to which you refer ? It would be germane to further comment.
No I am not concerned about personal info as this is not listed. I don't feel it is necessary to give info about myself other than I am a boat owner and like a little privacy. The reason I am concerned is I feel it is wrong and unfair to publish details of my private property on the Internet without my consent. I am reluctant to give out the URL as I don't want to give free publicity to this idiot. I am sure other contributors will come up with the details.
http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/jim.shead/boats.html
no opinion one way or the other worse things happen at sea!
no relations to site etc
cheers Joe
I accept and support your wish for your boat's details to remain private knowledge. You may have a case under the Data Protection Act that you yourself can be identified as a human being and / or as the owner of a boat by virtue of the combination of data (boat name, location, type, etc). If that is so, then the RYA legal people might be able to offer specific advice or case history ?
Check with the Information Commissioner's Office also. They have a pretty quick turn round of questions.
Info Here (http://www.ico.gov.uk/Home/what_we_cover/data_protection.aspx)
Quick work !
There may be genuine reasons why a person may not wish to have details (possibly given in confidence ?) made available on the net by an individual.
We had a case at work where we had to remove an important person from an emergency callout list because she was a single mother living apart from a violent partner in the same company. Fortunately the case was resolved peacefully.
Difficult to make a decision about whether Beryl's rights have been breached or security threatened, based on the information we have at the moment.
there is nothing there to link any boat details back to an individual though. Just the name dimensions and power source, and it registration number. Any of which can be easily obtained
Dave_Seager
06-01-07, 18:27
There is very little information on the web site that could not be deduced from seeing the boat itself. Only the engine size if not immediately apparent externally. If you had not seen the boat, you probably would not know the name to look up the details so I do not see any problem.
Personally, I found it interesting to see where boats that I previously owned are now being used.
It's nothing to get excited about, it only states that a boat of a particular name exists in the registration region. It also mentions who made it and what type of engine etc.
It is apparently a useful website for some people, not least of which are those who are thinking of what to name their boat.
A load of emails went around last year about this very site and he agreed to take some information off of his listings. I don't think you can call him an idiot, it is interesting information.
Ian
Steve Clayton
06-01-07, 18:37
See page 7 as to what they say they can do with your information.
http://www.environment-agency.gov.uk/commondata/acrobat/2007_annual_form_1569292.pdf
Can't see how this guy's website constitutes a "public register". Makes an absolute *******s of what the DP Act is for (IMHO)
We can call him an idiot because he calls himself an idiot on his web site. If you have no objections to providing information about your property, then in your replies, please include information about your car, including the make, model, engine type, and registration number
For £4 you can find out who owns a property , where they are living and contact details . How do you think property developers get the run down houses , do you think they are just lucky ?
Steve Clayton
06-01-07, 19:10
NCP and car park enforcement companies (clampers) get your personal details from DVLA.
Finance/insurance companies buy the electoral rolls to quickly validate your location/status if you apply for loans and car/house insurance.
All the more reason to keep your personal information as private as possible (IMHO)
Steve Clayton
06-01-07, 19:23
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please include information about your car, including the make, model, engine type, and registration number
[/ QUOTE ]
C'mon, I run a one man (and SWMBO) one boat charter co. I can't afford a car!!!
www.americas-cup2007.com (http://www.americas-cup2007.com)
This topic was the subject of a Shock Horror thread some year(s) ago. At that time Jim Shead's data was said to be about two years old.
Be that as it may, the EA is about to get clearance for its licensing "harmonisation" scheme which in effect will be like the Harmonisation of Red Diesel (I hope not...)
As a result of pressure from me (well I like to think that anybody like Li'l old Me could have influence on a gov't body) and probably a few others, the Transport and Works Order PartII S.10 has been amended to remove the obligation to keep a public register and substituting a requirement to release details only to a "responsible authority" (which is then further defined). This also includes current details.
The Order will possibly come int effect later this year.
So a win for me?
I have until 1st. February to reinforce or object again.
BTW when I created a stink on these Fora I was subjected to a wave of indifference (with I think two kind supporters), so you get what you deserve....
Beryl I understand your concern. I was a bit shocked the first time I saw this list, especially as at the time it also included my 'home port'. (which is now removed)
In the context of freedom of information .. I feel the info doesn't connect very much with me as a person. Having said that giving information en masse to someone to publish on their own website for worldwide viewing does stretch the principle of freedom of information IMHO. I would expect the EA to have an indicator in their database which could be activated if you complain so that your boat details cannot be distributed in this casual manner.
As Mr Shead is actually using the data to complement his own online sales activity then I believe this practice is not acceptable. As Trueblue says .. this cannot be regarded as a responsible authority. If he has brought pressure to bear on this isssue then my thanks to him.
Andrew_Fanner
07-01-07, 09:36
And last year someone with a grievance about a speeding boat was aided by the aboved mentioned list on tracking down the offender...
Doesn't worry me, and has its uses when us hapless members of the public try to challenge "official" gures about numbers or types/locations of boats. It also lets you check that officialdom has actually got your data right, a friend with a narrowboat was amused, but horrified about his 200hp engine, assuming that anything that daft meant people who had no idea what they were doing.
[ QUOTE ]
A sad man who runs a website about boating has applied to EA and BW for this information and published it on his own site. What do people think?
[/ QUOTE ] I think you are making far more of this than it really merits and thus upsetting yourself unnecessarily. As others have said, in the very limited information published on that site, there is absolutely nothing to link the boat back to an individual. It's very unlikely, therefore, that it falls foul of any privacy/protection rules. Rest easy!
(Ford Mondeo Ghia 155PS Diesel estate, White Grape metallic, self-leveling suspension, sat-nav. and heated seats /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif)
What no cup-holders?
(Two wheeler with stabilisers and a panier)
Yea, its got cup-holders but I didn't want peeps to think I was showing off /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
(hang on - if you admit to driving a Mondeo, surely no-one thinks you're showing off anyway!)
ps no ashtray on your two-wheeler then?
I think you are missing the point, from that website I cannot tell which is your boat. I would have no problem with a web site that tells you all that my car registration exists. It WOULDN'T tell you it was mine nor where I lived nor where I kept it.
Hi Beryl
A far more revealing website is the ITU. If you have a ships radio fitted to your boat someone can look up the boats name and find your Surname and then with both names, electoral roll, etc, where you live.....
A burglar can then check if the boats out, the house is likely to be empty - scarey!
(14yr old Volvo, 1 heated seat, cup holders) /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
(Two wheeler with stabilisers and a panier)
That would be the Zimmerf rame GL model then? /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Is that the one with power assisted steering? /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif
The site has been know to many of us for some two years. I fail to see any problem. In the old days when Lloyds List was published you could not only get the scant details Shead supplies, you could get a complete breakdown including the name of the owner.
the last Lloyds was published in 1980 the Debretts published the same information for two years
There is a site that does detail if a car registration exists. It also states the make and model, colour (I think), the date it was last taxed and when the tax or SORN is due.
I don't see this as a problem, I've looked on this site a few times for old boats of mine to see if they are still about. In fact it would be better if it contained some more information, useful when checking for boats for sale to verify engine spec etc... previous owners etc...
Its no different to going to the DVLA site and doing a search on a registration number, tells you make and engine size tax expiry date etc.... http://www.dvla.gov.uk/vehicles.aspx
I'm not sure how this information can be used againest you?
Hi all
Thank you for your responses but I think you misunderstood the point I was making. I am not concerned with anyone tracing me via my boat but I think it is wrong that people can publish details of my private property without my permission. The registration number of my boat, it's make and model and engines are all listed. It is interesting to note that not one person who is in favour of the listing has put the details of their car on this site. Your spare time and your hobbies should be private but Chris_d doesn't seem to mind. So Chris Just to give you an example of how nothing is sacred. I hope you enjoyed your trip into Abingdon on 29th October 2006 where you moored nearly opposite the church. Four persons onboard and a dog! I won't give your home mooring details but these were once listed.
Best wishes
Beryl
Blimey Beryl, I hate the internet you think your safe talking to people who you assume must be miles away and it turns out they live round the corner, or are you a spook. If you can tell me where the boat was on the 23rd July say, i'll be impressed and err... slightly more worried.
Spook would be more like it and I live a minimum of 70 miles away from you. My access to information is vast and should not be used for these purposes so I don't want to risk too many downloads. Don't forget to put the information about your car on your next post. Or are you worried!
Best wishes
Beryl
We'll I'm certainly intrigued how you got that information, I guess some could come from Lockeepers records but that wouldn't explain how where we moored, I can't even remember how many people were on board myself, think it was only 3 or was Beryl my own personel stalker there!
She said she lived 70 miles from you, not that she was 70 miles from Abingdon on 29/10. We could work up several plausible explanations as to why she knew you were there. People who claim access to sources of information that 'you cannot begin to imagine exist' are normally trying to pull the wool. Genuine cases would not advertise they knew, especially on open forums such as this.
this being one of them
http://www.ybw.com/forums/showflat.php?Number=1152391&page=7
you could take it from the incident that it happened the prior weekend though I don't read it that way, that he and swmbo'd and two others and dog onboard.
Not difficult to work out where moored.
I'd be happier if Chris knew where he was on the date in question, and how many on board etc.
We'll this is a bit spooky or is it, I keep a log of every trip and that was practicaly the only trip we made in October on the 29th to Abingdon, there were 3 on board + dog and we did indeed moor at the downstream end of the Abingdon bridge free moorings roughly opposite the church, but so does everyone.
How of course its easy to get carried away thinking of how she could have accessed EA records, found my name possibly tracked my mobile (historicaly I don't think possible), used satalite imagery, used EA boat movement records (which i'm sure aren't that detalied) etc, etc....
Actualy I think she got lucky, Beryl was visiting Abingdon and walked past, not many boats about. Several people spoke to me whilst I was on the bankside playing with the dog, he's a bit more sociable than me and plays with anyone!
Steve Clayton
10-01-07, 10:01
[ QUOTE ]
Genuine cases would not advertise they knew, especially on open forums such as this.
[/ QUOTE ]
If it's findable on the internet then it's in the public domain.
How was Bolswold in the summer of 2004, did you enjoy the mussels?
Where's Bolswold? I've never been there and Google can't make much of it either /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif
The information in question could only have been determined by actualy being there or by illegal methods, Beryl is using a bit of misinformation too prove her point.
Steve Clayton
10-01-07, 10:38
Sorry; meant Bolsward. Surely you remember - you were moored up at Sneek.
Andrew_Fanner
10-01-07, 10:54
Aha, you have to provide details of your car to establish why you are unworried.
Here they are:
Don't have one.
While I am typing this my boat is unattended, moored happily at the club and findable on the interwebby thingy by use of boat name and mine:-)
Thats better. /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif Yes , I was in Sneek, didn't go to Bolsward until the following month.
The mussels were fine but then they were the local home-grown ones, not the common-or-garden Atlantic rubbish the French rave about. I know where you got your information from but that hardly amounts to the sort of 'secret source' that Beryl seemed to suggest she had access to. Incidentally, Ian Hart has since passed away. Bloody shame, he was a really great bloke and a proper gentleman.
That list was not very up to date even when it included home moorings. It said my boat was on the Thames at Oxford, when in fact it had been on the Nene for two years before being taken to the Gt Ouse.
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The information in question could only have been determined by actualy being there or by illegal methods, Beryl is using a bit of misinformation too prove her point.
[/ QUOTE ]
Or perhaps the source whas a private duck?
http://www.vac-u-boat.com/images/MockDuck2.jpg
Great imagination but still no idea and no vehicle details.
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