Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 11 to 18 of 18
  1. #11
    MrCramp is offline Registered User
    Location : East Midlands
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Posts
    1,538

    Default Re: Lifejackets again

    I lost 2 mates a year ago who were older than me, very experienced, and thought they were good swimmers. One of them took the micky out of me for always wearing a life jacket when out boating.

    They drowned.

    Went out in the dinghy to the yacht and were found washed up next morning.

    Waste of time trying to persuade others to always wear life jackets, look at all the daft comments that have been made already.

    The 6 distraught children of these chaps do wish their fathers had been more sensible.

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Posts
    3,329

    Default Re: Lifejackets again

    ...."but I find The goody goody brigade (simile - read sanctimoneous) are ramming H & S down everyone throat is making safety even more difficult as people are stopping thinking for themselves and doing their own natural appraisal of any situation (In H & S parlance - risk analysis)"

    an excellent quote, and good example of, commonly lacking, common sense.

  3. #13
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    6,407

    Default Re: Lifejackets again

    At the age of 71 I am delighted to be seen as one of a "new breed" after some 55 years experience of yachting across the world which includes 30+ years as a RYA Yachtmaster Examiner and 12 years as a seamanship instructor at the Plymouth School of Maritime Studies. I can't be seen as riding my own high horse as I belong to the Plymouth Lifeboat Sea Safety team and feel I have a responsibility to spread the Gospel According to the RNLI whom I regard as the experts in these matters, and I am proud to serve them wherever I can.

    You only "suspect" more toddlers died in swimmimg pool accidents, and that is your prerogative. It is not up to me to tell you how many caualties died because they were not wearing a lifejacket, but I do respect the experience of the RNLI who started their lifejacket campaign a few years ago. Try asking them, or check the MCA figures if you really want to know.
    My own direct experience was pulling a near death canoeist from the wintery waters of Fowey Harbour some years ago who later admitted he would have been better off if he had worn a lifejacket. I doubt I have persuaded you in this matter you seem so firmly set in your attitude, but I can only try.
    Now, go and take those glass baubles off your Christmas tree in case you cut yourself if one breaks, there's a good chap.
    Cornishmen do it drekly

  4. #14
    Robin's Avatar
    Robin is offline Registered User
    Location : Daytona Beach, Florida
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Posts
    11,483

    Default Re: Lifejackets again

    You might remember my post about us being towed in from Le Raz De Sein by a French lifeboat this summer. None of the French Lifeboat crew were wearing lifejackets, all had a variety of footwear from wooden slip on clogs to peep toe sandals, teeshirts and shorts. Unlike the RNLI they don't dress for winter in a Southern Ocean storm for a mid summer tow job but use some commonsense.

    Over the years too I have sailed with a number of RNLI crews from offshore and inshore boats and again none wore lifejackets on their own boats as a routine, only when they thought it better to do so. It is only relatively recently that the RNLI has taken the Gnu Labour approach and started preaching.

    As a general rule I don't wear a lifejacket when on board any more than I would if I were on a cruise ship or a ferry. I might wear one if making a rough trip out/back to the boat in the dinghy but probably more likely I would not have made that dodgy dinghy trip in the first place. At what point do you stop needing one on board, using the BBQ, in bed, or when? If you give answer to any of those questions it implies some commonsense applies and therefore no need for enforcement by decree, governmental or RNLI.

    I'm not advocating something akin to civil disobedience just the use of simple commonsense and doing what is sensible for your circumstances at the time. If that means wearing a lifejacket when others are not then that is fine but so is the reverse. In any case I would always make a case for wearing a harness more than a lifejacket although ours are in fact combined.
    Sermons from my pulpit are with tongue firmly in cheek and without any warranty!

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    9,646

    Default Re: Lifejackets again

    You completely miss my point.

    Firstly if you are going to threaten dire risk treat people in an educated manner and appraise them of the risk backed up with statistics.

    I do nearly always wear a lifejacket and recommend others do unless it gets in the way of a suntan. As skipper I insist if we are reefed or at night.

    What I am against is making it compulsary or implying stupidity if you don't.

    If we treated people with respect and educated them to evaluate the real risks then people will react with more responsibility and become more safety conscious.

    On my boat the internal steps in a deck saloon followed by boiling water out of the taps and fingers in winches are the major concerns only then followed by an accidental gybe/going overboard.

    We are reaching the point where H & S BS is stoping many from identifying the real risks and the copious H & S warnings in instruction books are making access to the real meat and sense of the instruction difficult if not impossible to identify.

    Your litany of your vast experience does not make your right but I would evaluate your biggest risk as complacency followed by I have always done it this way!!

    Never underestimate the distortion of statics by organisations that want to justify themselves.

    Again I ask you how many people died in the UK from going overboard when a lifejacket would have saved them?

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Posts
    6,407

    Default Re: Lifejackets again

    ...and again, if you really want to know use the official statistics sites. I don't keep count, so stop asking me.
    As for your accusations about complacency you are completely wrong. The day I stop learning will be the day I put an anchor over my shoulder and walk inland until somebody asks me what it is. I have not said I am right, or wrong, but merely offer the advice being suggested by the RNLI safety team. They have no vested interest, but just good old fashioned common sense born out of vast experience. As they say, lifejackets are useless if not worn.
    You, too, have overlooked the fact that nowhere will you see that I have advocated the compulsory wearing of anything. What I have said is that compulsion day gets nearer the more people do not use their common sense. Think using mobile phones while driving f'rinstance.
    You do what you like, accept or ignore advice, but don't blame me if the "do gooders" manage to make it compulsory. I have spent many years fighting the good fight against compulsory certification by following the old RYA adage "education before legislation" and that is how I feel about wearing lifejackets.
    Cornishmen do it drekly

  7. #17
    DavenHelen's Avatar
    DavenHelen is offline Registered User
    Location : UK, Lancashire
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    4,111

    Default Re: Lifejackets again

    [ QUOTE ]

    You do what you like, accept or ignore advice, but don't blame me if the "do gooders" manage to make it compulsory. I have spent many years fighting the good fight against compulsory certification by following the old RYA adage "education before legislation" and that is how I feel about wearing lifejackets.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    From your RNLI article:_

    [ QUOTE ]
    RNLI research has found that 98% of people surveyed carry a lifejacket. However, further evidence shows that only 52% of people often wear their lifejackets, compared with 42% that say they wear their lifejackets all the time."

    [/ QUOTE ]

    That is 94% of people wear their life jackets often or all the time. I would suggest that the RNLI would be better off with a campaign specifically targeted at wearing LJs in tenders as it does appear to be a major element of the casualties.
    Dave - "Never underestimate the power of human stupidity."

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    9,646

    Default Re: Lifejackets again

    Still interested in knowing what "69% of incidents" represents 2 people saved or 2000?

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •