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  1. #41
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    [QUOTE=maxcampbell;3510925]Really expected to be taken up on my assertions...QUOTE]
    OK, I'll bite. How does that work? I thought the gaff, sails and lines would all blow away to leeward making a horrible mess.

  2. #42
    maxcampbell's Avatar
    maxcampbell is offline Registered User
    Location : Me - village in south cambs. Boat - Brightlingsea
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    The weight of the gaff brings the top of the sail down, depowering it instantly. It wasn't something we'd expected, but we never bother heading up to drop the main, whether to stow or take in a reef, but we do to raise it.

  3. #43
    chinita is offline Registered User
    Location : Norfolk, boats: Pin Mill & Lagos
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    Quote Originally Posted by BobPrell View Post
    Dylan, my mind's eye keeps seeing your boats (slug and the minstrel's) with junk rig.
    I agree. I don't know why he does not just go for a Coromandel at half the price.

    I would.

  4. #44
    prv is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by mezereon View Post
    OK, I'll bite. How does that work? I thought the gaff, sails and lines would all blow away to leeward making a horrible mess.
    The difference from a conventional mast is that there's no track, the mast is simply a cylindrical pole. The gaff jaws sit around it, and the luff of the sail is held to it not by a boltrope or sliders in a track, but by a lacing or solid hoops around the mast. None of these things care which way the boat underneath the mast is pointing, they'll still slide quite happily up and down their round pole.

    Were the mast free-standing, you'd be able to hoist and lower the sail downwind of it, whatever the angle of the boat. Junk rigs can. Gaffers bigger than a small dinghy will have shrouds, so the sail can't swing forward of the mast. So the sail comes down easily with the wind anywhere forward of the beam; if I have the wind on the beam and want to lower the main I just do, even if I have room to turn head to wind I just don't need to. With the wind aft of the beam, the sail has to come down full. It will still do so, but it's a bit messy, graunching against the shrouds. So I avoid this if possible, but it is still an option.

    Pete

  5. #45
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    Default too heavy

    Quote Originally Posted by chinita View Post
    I agree. I don't know why he does not just go for a Coromandel at half the price.

    I would.
    I think that a junk rig requires a lot of weight and windage up high

    and.....

    aesthetically they leave me stone cold

    Dylan

  6. #46
    Fantasie 19's Avatar
    Fantasie 19 is offline Registered User
    Location : Chichester, West Sussex
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    Quote Originally Posted by dylanwinter View Post
    I think that a junk rig requires a lot of weight and windage up high

    and.....

    aesthetically they leave me stone cold

    Dylan
    ...agreed... more than any other a real "marmite" rig...
    Never knowingly undersailed...
    http://hurley20sparrow.blogspot.com/

  7. #47
    BobPrell is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by dylanwinter View Post
    I think that a junk rig requires a lot of weight and windage up high
    Point taken, but peeps should realize weight aloft is not all a bad thing. It can make the motion of a vessel more comfortable. It's about rotational inertia.
    2210 Edited to add -- I should mention that gaff/gunter/junk rigs lower a more significant amount of the weight/windage when they reef.
    aesthetically they leave me stone cold

    Dylan
    That's your taste, I won't try to change it, but will say some people, a significant minority I hope, find it appealing.
    Last edited by BobPrell; 29-04-12 at 13:10. Reason: reefing remark
    A l'eau. C'est l'heure.

  8. #48
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    Default well done Bob

    Quote Originally Posted by BobPrell View Post
    Point taken, but peeps should realize weight aloft is not all a bad thing. It can make the motion of a vessel more comfortable. It's about rotational inertia.


    That's your taste, I won't try to change it, but will say some people, a significant minority I hope, find it appealing.
    good, rational answers

    of course I assume that a gunter has a fair bit of wight up high

    vertainly when you lift the bermudan mast it is pretty light

    then lift the shorter mast for the gunter - and add the gaff(if that the right word) it adds up

    D

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by dylanwinter View Post
    I think that a junk rig requires a lot of weight and windage up high

    and.....

    aesthetically they leave me stone cold

    Dylan
    There is no rig uglier than a pointy and stressed bermudan. It represents the triumph of technology and brute force over subtlety and the genius of a simple solution.

    Aesthetically, for me, there is only the junk rig though gaff/gunter is also fairly pleasing to the eye.

  10. #50
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    I'm not sure if anyone else raised this issue, but as the boat was designed with a gunter rig, surely converting it to bermudan sloop moved the centre of effort forward, so the obvious question is which rig gives the best balance on the helm? Other things being equal I would look at the big advantage of the gunter rig when it comes to lowering the mast and transporting the boat on a trailer. The shorter spars must be easier then.
    Last edited by Norman_E; 29-04-12 at 18:40.
    Working on immortality - One day at a time.

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