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  1. #31
    Babylon's Avatar
    Babylon is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solent Joe View Post
    By Folkboat, are you also including the wooden derivatives or just GRP?
    Maintenance issues aside, it doesn't make any difference. The observation was that there are a good number of folkboat-derived designs around that were not only robustly-built but are now available within range of your fairly low budget.

    Quote Originally Posted by Solent Joe View Post
    would an outboard be up for the job? or should I really be looking at inboards?
    It depends on how you're conceiving of your trip. If you're rushing to meet deadlines and the wind is wrong for your destination, then a reasonable inboard will make up time. If you're interested in sailing but need an auxilliary for getting into and out of harbours, then an outboard will suffice.
    http://www.smiletrain.org.uk - charity for child cleft palate surgery

  2. #32
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    Default Outboard/Inboard

    Pros and cons for both.small Diesel inboards tend to be reliable and frugal on fuel .Modern outboards are also generally reliable and have the advantage that if they go wrong you can take iot to someone to fix or swap it for another one in 10 minutes.

    Depends on the boat you get , some boats are suitable for outboards some arent.An outboard mounted in a well will be more efficient than one on a transom bracket and the prop wont come out of the water when pitching.Generally I dont think the folkboat types are ideally suited to an outboard but I know people do have them.

  3. #33
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    Default beautifully put

    Quote Originally Posted by graham View Post
    Pros and cons for both.small Diesel inboards tend to be reliable and frugal on fuel .Modern outboards are also generally reliable and have the advantage that if they go wrong you can take iot to someone to fix or swap it for another one in 10 minutes.

    Depends on the boat you get , some boats are suitable for outboards some arent.An outboard mounted in a well will be more efficient than one on a transom bracket and the prop wont come out of the water when pitching.Generally I dont think the folkboat types are ideally suited to an outboard but I know people do have them.
    in a nutshell.

    I agree with everything this man says

    Dylan

  4. #34
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    Thanks for that Graham, some points I hadn't considered there.

    Dylan, in response to your earlier questions- I'm 20, of very good fitness, have been sailing 7 years and am going round at a fair pace. What would your suggestion be based on this info?

    Joe

  5. #35
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    Fascadale is offline Registered User
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    I think you should be able to it in three months.

    I did Edinburgh to Edinburgh via the Solent in six weeks last summer and a couple of years ago sailed from Tobermory to Edinburgh via Scapa in twelve days .

    You do have to press on though: put the motor on if the speed drops much below 4kts, put in a few 24hr+ passages, Milford Haven to Falmouth, Lowestoft to Grimsby, Peterhead to Wick is another long one.

    Not much time for sight seeing: save your down time for when the weather is bad or something breaks on the boat. I was stuck in Brighton for five days with a duff gearbox and Grimsby for another five days with a gale.

    I wouldn't like to try it with only an outboard. Its a very long way, the weather is often not great, there are places with fierce tides and you are not giving yourself much leeway, time wise.

    I did it in an Invicta 26, smallish, no standing headroom, a bit damp but generally a satisfactory sailing boat. Lots of different boats would be suitable. Some people do it in open dinghy's, some in sea kayaks. As long as its basically seaworthy it should do the job. I would look for something small with a decent motor.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solent Joe View Post
    I'm looking to sail single-handed around Britain via Cape Wrath in the next couple of years (still very much in the planning stage! ) however, I've planned on purchasing a boat in the coming months- most probably being the one that will take me around Britain, so I need to take appropriate features into account.

    What should I look for in a boat to complete a single-handed circumnavigation? obviously overall build quality etc, but anything specific? also any boats in particular that I should keep away from/tend towards?

    My budget for the boat is around £5K excluding refit.

    While I'm here, other general tips from those of you who have completed this circumnavigation would be great!
    Just about any well found boat will do but I would start by looking at the Contessa 26, Sadler 25 and Albin Vega. These are all advertised for a little more than your budget but who knows what people might accept in the present financial market. Its often better for someone to accept an offer £2 to £3 K less than the asking price to avoid an extra years insurance//berthing/hardstanding and allow them to get on with purchasing their new dream.

    Failing those the Corribee or Hurley 22 are good well proven options.

    I would try and get an inboard rather than an outboard. Transom mounted outboards are a complete no-no for this sort of trip. They simply will not provide any drive in any sort of seaway. Mounted in a well they are much better but you still have the problem that they will not provide any significant charge to your battery and you will have to come up with an alternate charging system. Expect to do a lot more motoring than you might previously have envisaged. Everyone finds this to be the case.

    If you are single handing you must have a reliable system for self-steering. There is no such thing as a waterproof stand alone tiller pilot. Despite what the manufacturers claim the standard offerings all leak when subject to bad weather. You can improve matters by making a cover out of a tube of polythene but they are essentially fair weather/motoring aids. I would suggest you learn how to set up sheet to tiller steering – at least as a back up.

    You could theoretically do the trip in 3 months but you might easily find yourself pushed for time. We only took 9 weeks (including a week off to fly back home) but we did some very long legs and were extremely lucky with the weather, losing only one day to gales.

    You may have seen my videos of the trip. If not see “Right hand Down a Bit” http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ey6JK...&feature=g-upl

  7. #37
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    Default Since you ask....

    Quote Originally Posted by Solent Joe View Post
    Thanks for that Graham, some points I hadn't considered there.

    Dylan, in response to your earlier questions- I'm 20, of very good fitness, have been sailing 7 years and am going round at a fair pace. What would your suggestion be based on this info?

    Joe
    20 is good - lots of energy

    small cabin

    three months is really short

    I have yet to sail around the UK but I have owned two trailer sailers so I have sailed in a lot of places - spent my fare share of time sitting glumly in the cockpit under a tarp over the boom listening to weather forecasts.

    Several times with the trailer sailer I sailed one way, got a bus to pick up the car and drove back the other way. Tobermory has got me twice now.

    But you might consider stepping back a bit

    you need to decide why you are doing the journey

    If you are doing the journey for bragging rights....

    well there is nothing wrong with that at your age.
    Having something to brag about is good. proving to yourself you are tough is also great. When I was 18 I went to work on cattle ranch in canada

    frightened myself lots of times

    but if you want to sail just for the adventure

    - well there are lots of adventures to be had anywhere around our coasts - The west coast of scotland is wonderfully crinkly and gets as wild as you could ever want. If you want lonliness you can find it - some of those sea locks are so dark and forbidding

    wonderful and frightening - laying to an anchor scraping through pebbles or weeds with winds howling down the mountain sides at you.

    passing through corryvrecken

    sail to Ireland - some great places - some amazing people - lovely, lovely drinking sessions, great music. beautiful women.

    My advice is to not worry too much about the target of sailing around this island - if you become a sailor aim to do it before you die - you have loads of time

    buy a boat - maybe a rubbbish boat with a great outboard- and sail the socks off it for three months

    that way you can buy a worse boat and have more money

    buy that bilge keeled corribbe - sail a beautiful boat that sails beautifully

    buy an old westerly 22 - sail a bit of British history


    But if you really are goal focussed then go for the circumnavigation by all means

    but

    It seems to me that you problem is more with an engine than a boat - you have to have a reliable engine

    there can be few things more huimilating than being saved by the RNLI

    and finding a good boat under £5,000 with a good inboard is going to be next to impossible

    that is what I think

    although others will tell you different.

    you could get around the UK in a well found 16 foot fishing boat with a 5 hp on the back

    your brains would be mush at the end of every day but you would achieve you goal

    I think you have to go for a sailing boat with an outboard in a well or close in to the transom - no massifve overhang

    that way for £1200 you can have rock solid engine reliability and battery charging of sorts.


    I think that to enjoy our coastline you need a boat that could take the ground as that will keep your costs down and make all sorts of cheap and intersting harbours available to you

    it will also mean that you probably don't need a dinghy

    I have a £30 beach inflatable that I have used twice

    a boat that can take the ground means that you could take it to any cheap yard - which is to be found hidden away up almost every creek in the UK

    - ask them to stick in a corner, drop the mast and put a tarp over it and it can sit there for ththree years before you come back

    again the outboard scores here because that can be put safely in your dad's garage

    how much time do you have to prep the boat?

    How much money do you have?

    I would set another target - swim in Fingals cave

    sail to the Scillies, the channel islands, the orkneys

    our coast has more than enough adventure for a life-time of sailing

    no need top eat it all at once

    Dylan
    Last edited by dylanwinter; 08-05-12 at 23:46.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solent Joe View Post
    aslaband- thanks, that was quite informative. By Folkboat, are you also including the wooden derivatives or just GRP?

    .....

    Finally, would an outboard be up for the job? or should I really be looking at inboards?

    Joe
    Joe, don't have anything against wooden folk boats but I would guess grp is less maintenance.

    As for outboard v's inboard. On a small boat (of which I include mine) neither motor type is really going to power into any sort of weather faster than sailing. The auxiliary really come into their own in and out of port and when the wind dies and you can chug along at 4 1/2 knots till it fills in again. Both sorts can do this. Inboard diesels are fitted lower in the boat and nearer the centre of gravity which s good. Diesels tend to be more fuel efficient. Inboards have the prop behind the rudder, the props tend to be higher so can lift out the water but they are lighter and if they do break you can drive it to someone to fix it. Outboards are cheaper.... probably. Just don't take them to a main dealer for a service (they took my first born last time and are after my soul for the next service).

  9. #39
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    Thanks for that extensive answer Dylan.

    Quote Originally Posted by dylanwinter View Post

    But you might consider stepping back a bit

    you need to decide why you are doing the journey
    My drive to do this is mainly as an experience, a landmark in my life. I've realised that although I tend to spend money wisely, anything I do spend on luxury goods. Nice as they are, they don't contribute to me as a person- my character, and knowledge from life experiences.

    Other reasons do include adventure, and proving to myself I can achieve what I set my mind to- I am a very target-driven person and being able to say to myself "I sailed around Britain" rather than "I sailed around the South Coast for three months" is a lot more quantifiable, and not so much bragging rights as satisfying myself.. I'd have to do something a bit different (and probably a lot easier!) to satisfy my peers.

    I do wish to fully explore our coastline in the future, much as you are doing. I think by sailing round I can see the overall picture, then focus my energy into the areas I wish to go back to, without the pressuring myself to get around the UK, as that goal will have been completed.

    Quote Originally Posted by dylanwinter View Post
    It seems to me that you problem is more with an engine than a boat - you have to have a reliable engine
    I'm currently studying for a Master's degree in Mechanical Engineering, so I have the willingness and knowledge to get involved with the engine- that should hopefully count for something out there! I understand this by no means solves the problem, an unreliable engine can't really be helped, but hopefully I should be able to get a half decent engine through the trip.

    Quote Originally Posted by dylanwinter View Post
    how much time do you have to prep the boat?

    How much money do you have?
    I'm looking to purchase the boat between September and early next year- I want to hold out on getting a good boat at the right price. This will give me at least a year, maybe two, to get used to the yacht. I will slowly refit the yacht over this time, obviously leaving the most critical components to be fitted as close to the trip as possible, as not to wear them out at all.

    I have £5k to spend on the boat, £5k spread over 1 or 2 yrs for the long "refit" and £3k set aside for the trip itself.

    Thanks again for your time in giving a well-thought reply

    Joe

  10. #40
    tonybannister is offline Registered User
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    Achilles 24 would suit (see achillesyachts website). Dylans advice was good and like him I like the old westerly 22 but you would need more than 3 months to get round Britain in one of those. You will need a boat that moves in light winds and can look after you in heavy weather to meet your target. There are several Achilles for sale at £3k or under but some are for sale up to £5 or even over that have had a lot of work done on them and lots of money spent on them. Look for one of those. Read big bloke - small boat - voyage of a madman by William Garnier.

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