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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Southampton
    Posts
    35,090

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    Quote Originally Posted by Timpenny670 View Post
    Keel it left up as i understand that it's not a good idea to leave it down.
    I've never had a lift-keel boat, but I can't see any reason not to leave it down if the water is deep enough at your mooring.

    If not, if it will ground at low tide, then best left up.

    Pete

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Cambridge
    Posts
    237

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    Quote Originally Posted by prv View Post
    I've never had a lift-keel boat, but I can't see any reason not to leave it down if the water is deep enough at your mooring.
    Barnacles jamming the keel down is what I've heard. No direct experience.
    Mostly solo sailing the 6m junk-rigged Tammy Norie. https://tammynorie.wordpress.com/

  3. #13
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Second Coast, Ross-shire, overlooking Gruinard Bay.
    Posts
    6,937

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    Welcome to "our world" and great good luck.

    Forgive the thread-drift.
    Your experience reminded me of my own recently, on a swinging mooring in the Tay estuary off the Royal Tay YC (Dundee).
    Khamsin is 9.3metres, weighs about 3.5 tonnes + stores etc.
    I was asleep, at about 03:00 when she started rocking violently - cups etc fell from open lockers etc, I nearly fell from bunk. I assumed it was the wash from a passing cargo vessel.

    This happened again a few nights later, 02:00. I looked outside to catch the culprit - nothing in sight. (daylight down there in June at that time!)

    I noticed later a very slight send coming in from the estuary - again this rocked her violently. And she weighs 3.5t, has a fin keel and is very stable in notable seas.

    Obviously the form of that send is enough to create unusually strong "under-surface" disturbance.
    Just thought I'd mention it.
    Kay Sarah Sarah
    5751.42' N 529.44' W

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Northern Ireland
    Posts
    11,478

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    I have a 28 foot long keel wooden boat which has a bit of mass to it and even so it can rock like mad in the right conditions. I expect that as long as the keel is up on yours you are going to bob about like a cork when anyone sends their wash your way. I wouldn't worry about it, corks don't often sink! Ways to reduce it are to increase mass, lower mass or spread mass wider. You can also change the alignment of your boat so that you are head on to most of the wash but that could be tricky. Changes in the arrangement of mass on the boat will all have particular effects which you can look up online but it tends to be a little unpredictable in real life so trial and error. An other alternative is to use buckets over the side which will resist movement through the water and dampen any roll. They will chaffe though.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    up on the moors.
    Posts
    33,015

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    Have you considered rigging flopper stoppers while at anchor or on the buoy ?

    http://www.offshore-sailor.com/boat-...-yourself.html
    I think, therefore I am. I am, therefore I sail.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Cambridge
    Posts
    237

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    I like that. And it's the same shape as my anchor hatch. I wonder if it can do double duty…
    Mostly solo sailing the 6m junk-rigged Tammy Norie. https://tammynorie.wordpress.com/

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Portugal-Algarve
    Posts
    1,748

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    Quote Originally Posted by Timpenny670 View Post
    Many thanks for your comments so far. I had a thought in the middle of the night last night (lying awake worrying about her). In such a light boat, do you think that having a 25KG engine on one side would make her rock like this (we're talking window washing level of rock)? I read something about hanging weights from to side to lower center of gravity?

    Keel it left up as i understand that it's not a good idea to leave it down.

    'Fisherman', I would like to reassure you that my Timpenny is a learner boat for me, I will be using her in Southampton waters and maybe the Solent if the conditions are right. I'd like another 5 feet before embarking on anything more ambitious.

    Looking forward to your further thoughts.

    Why do you think that its not a good idea to leave the keel down ?
    There is no reason to be less comfortable than necessary when on board.
    If you are going to leave her long enough for enough beasties to grow and make future lifting difficult then it would be better to lift.
    Enjoy your boat - smaller have crossed the Atlantic.
    Dum spiro spero. Cras ingens iterabimus aequor.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Southampton
    Posts
    35,090

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    Quote Originally Posted by 25931 View Post
    If you are going to leave her long enough for enough beasties to grow and make future lifting difficult then it would be better to lift.
    Then they'll grow and stop it dropping instead

    (For this reason I once had to take the lid off the centreboard case of my uncle's Shrimper and start the keel down with a hammer.)

    Pete

  9. #19
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Portugal-Algarve
    Posts
    1,748

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    Quote Originally Posted by prv View Post
    Then they'll grow and stop it dropping instead

    (For this reason I once had to take the lid off the centreboard case of my uncle's Shrimper and start the keel down with a hammer.)

    Pete
    Lesser of two evils and depends on circumstances but with my swing keel I prefer to leave it 3/4 up.
    Dum spiro spero. Cras ingens iterabimus aequor.

  10. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    West Sussex / Hants
    Posts
    27,994

    Default Re: New to boating and need your help

    She's quite light and doesn't have a huge amount of ballast even for her displacement; one thought would be adding some internal ballast beside the keelcase sides, but that must be REALLY secure, and would frankly be a pain to do.

    Useful extra kit you could consider adding might be extra fresh water, bigger battery etc but they must be secure against wild conditions, imagine the boat inverting... extra kit will have a damping effect on her motion, but of course a slight loss in speed.

    Lift keels don't usually have as much lateral area as fixed keels, so have less resisitance to rolling; lowering the keel - if the mooring allows - would help a bit but not much.

    In answer to worries about barnacles etc jammng the keel up or down, all lift keel boats benefit greatly from having the keel dropped & raised every so often even if not going sailing.

    If it is a drying mooring, a common trick with swing keelers is to leave the keel raised but the purchase with a couple of inches of slack, so the keel is ' self cleaning ' - but watch out for wear on the keel plate and pin.

    If the sails are kept up such as on roller jib and stowed on boom, you could take them off and stow in the cabin to reduce a little weight high up.

    In reality, the moves above would only help a little.

    Sarabande's flopper stopper is well worth trying too.
    Anderson 22 Owners Association - For info please ask here or PM me.

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