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  1. #91
    Join Date
    May 2016
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    Suffolk
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    8,025

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    Quote Originally Posted by pvb View Post
    But the boats the OP mentioned were designed for a self-tacking jib...
    Standard fit is a 106% genoa, with options for a 90% self tacker or a 140% genoa. The self tacker represents a noticable performance hit in my book.

    There are better sailplan solutions for this boat than slab reefing and self tacking, IMO.

  2. #92
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    Milton Keynes - Boat at Levington
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    192

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    What would your suggestion be then? Just the standard man and genoa? Inmast furling substantially reduces the main sail area and I just have doubts on that system.

  3. #93
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    UK East Coast
    Posts
    36,644

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    Quote Originally Posted by dune16 View Post
    Inmast furling substantially reduces the main sail area and I just have doubts on that system.
    You have to ask yourself why, if your view is correct, so many boats that size are specified with in-mast furling.

  4. #94
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    UK East Coast
    Posts
    36,644

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulRainbow View Post
    Standard fit is a 106% genoa, with options for a 90% self tacker or a 140% genoa. The self tacker represents a noticable performance hit in my book.
    Well, it's nearer 92%, but I'd suggest as it's easier to use the performance hit versus the standard jib wouldn't be huge. It's a cruising boat, after all, not a racing boat.

  5. #95
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Suffolk
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    8,025

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    Quote Originally Posted by dune16 View Post
    What would your suggestion be then? Just the standard man and genoa? Inmast furling substantially reduces the main sail area and I just have doubts on that system.
    In mast furling has a greater workload reduction than self tacking jibs. The self tacking jib option reduces the headsail from 106% to 90%.

    I would go for the in mast furling system with a 140% genoa. You might lose a little mainsail area (not looked at the figures, so not sure of details) but you gain a significant area of headsail. Granted, self furling mains aren't great when furled beyond a certain point, but there is the option of a stormsail track on the mast. You could look into the option of an inner forestay, with self tacking staysail.

    As i said earlier, i single hand a 33 footer with a 140% genoa and tacking the genoa is a doddle. From what you've said, your sailing is likely to consist of cruising in fair weather with your family, so storm sails might not be top of your list, neither would short tacking, i would have thought. You could get teenage kids to handle an in mast main or a normal 140% genoa.

    Look at the setups the modern charter fleets are running. Read some reviews about modern production boats with in mast furling. Jeanneau have been fitting them for awhile on the SO range, been on the 40 and 43 for 15 years or more. The worst you'll read in a decent review is a comment about the slight performance loss.

    So yes, a furling mail doesn't give the very best performance, but neither does a self tacking jib. You need to swap a little of what could be available in "racing" trim for some ease of use and family comfort.

    Most of the negative comments you have read on here about furling mains will be based on Olde Worlde systems.

  6. #96
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    May 2016
    Location
    Suffolk
    Posts
    8,025

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    Quote Originally Posted by pvb View Post
    Well, it's nearer 92%, but I'd suggest as it's easier to use the performance hit versus the standard jib wouldn't be huge. It's a cruising boat, after all, not a racing boat.
    Personally, i'd rather have the 140% genny. But i'd most likely have a slutter rig with a self tacking staysail if i was ordering a new 419.

  7. #97
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    From the Needles to the Nab, from Cowes to St Catherine's
    Posts
    4,788

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    In mast with a 140% genoa is madness, IMHO
    Substance over style

  8. #98
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    32,180

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    Quote Originally Posted by dune16 View Post
    What would your suggestion be then? Just the standard man and genoa? Inmast furling substantially reduces the main sail area and I just have doubts on that system.
    If there is any loss in ultimate performance with an in mast it will be more than made up in normal cruising, particularly shorthanded by the convenience of the system and particularly the ability to exactly match the sail area to the conditions rather than being limited to effectively just 3 different sail areas. The first fixed reef loses 20-25% of mainsail area. You should have no worries about the reliability of the system as it is proven over many tens of thousands of boats.

    A self tacker is really no big advantage if the standard jib is 106%. The proportions of that rig are much the same as on my Bavaria and work well, except for downwind where you may want to consider a furling cruising chute. This is a much more versatile set up than either the 140% genoa or the self tacker. The problem with the 140% is that it is a pain to tack, but more importantly needs reefing down very early with consequent loss of shape. OK if you sail in areas of very light airs like some of the Med, but really not suitable for our mixed conditions.

    With the rig suggested you should be able to use full main and jib up to 20 knots of wind.

  9. #99
    Join Date
    May 2016
    Location
    Suffolk
    Posts
    8,025

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    Quote Originally Posted by Little Grebe View Post
    In mast with a 140% genoa is madness, IMHO
    Why ?

  10. #100
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    32,180

    Default Re: Single hand a Jeanneau 409/419?

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulRainbow View Post
    Personally, i'd rather have the 140% genny. But i'd most likely have a slutter rig with a self tacking staysail if i was ordering a new 419.
    You seem not to have sailed this sort of boat - they are fractionally rigged mainsail biased and that size genoa is neither necessary or desirable for our conditions. Very different rig from your masthead IOR influenced rig on your boat which needs a big genoa to get it going.

    What you are suggesting is not an option on the 419 as the sail combination I suggested earlier is more suitable - and is offered.

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