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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    Southminster, essex
    Posts
    5,907

    Default Re: Hailing & the new rules

    Quote Originally Posted by Quimby View Post
    In practice you'll react and say something like "proper course, the mark is over there" and they will say "this is my proper course". If you disagree you can point out why, sometimes this works, ..............

    Read more at http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread.php?

    Say? Racers scream and shout! don`t they?
    The point of my question being that under the rules total silence seems to be acceptable.
    Seems to me that is at odds with need to avoid a collision & requirement to give another yacht room to keep clear if one does not state its intention in such a situation
    It is all down to the fact that my wife does not understand me !!

  2. #12
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Me Edinburgh, boat JWD
    Posts
    4,333

    Default Re: Hailing & the new rules

    Quote Originally Posted by savageseadog View Post
    When is "proper course" totally clear and indisputable?
    After the protest meeting and all the appeal routes have been completed!

  3. #13
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    25,468

    Default Re: Hailing & the new rules

    Quote Originally Posted by Daydream believer View Post
    The point of my question being that under the rules total silence seems to be acceptable.
    Seems to me that is at odds with need to avoid a collision & requirement to give another yacht room to keep clear if one does not state its intention in such a situation
    The rules cover a wide variety of boats, hailing is not always very effective, so I can see the point of not relying on it.
    Nothing prevents anyone hailing when it helps.

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Posts
    16,979

    Default Re: Hailing & the new rules

    Quote Originally Posted by lw395 View Post
    The rules cover a wide variety of boats, hailing is not always very effective, so I can see the point of not relying on it.
    Nothing prevents anyone hailing when it helps.
    A hail can be denied, it could be misheard or genuinely not heard. What I assume is the rules now say is it's the incident itself that's the issue. B flag still required at a guess?
    If I'd wanted to live in a Banana Republic I'd have gone to South America.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Posts
    2,371

    Default Re: Hailing & the new rules

    Quote Originally Posted by Daydream believer View Post
    The point of my question being that under the rules total silence seems to be acceptable.
    Seems to me that is at odds with need to avoid a collision & requirement to give another yacht room to keep clear if one does not state its intention in such a situation
    Been like that for a while, other than hailing for room to tack at an obstruction. Nothing at all to stop you hailing another boat but no requirement. Good job. It would be pretty awkward if a right of way boat could be protested for not hailing.

    And the keep clear but is not required to anticipate any action of the right of way boat. Again, it would be much more complex if they were required to act on the stated intentions of another boat. Lots of room for ambiguity in the protest room.

  6. #16
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    7,073

    Default Re: Hailing & the new rules

    Daydream...

    The confusion about the new rules or the ones before is simply that the new 2017-2020 rules have made no change in this regard. In the 2013-2016 rules the same situation was there - that the only hail that has any meaning in the rules before an incident is the hail for room to tack. And in fact for many previous editions of the rules. This is nothing new, and has been the case for as long as I've been racing at least.
    The requirement to hail "Protest" if you wish to protest is also there, and has been for as long as I've been racing.

    The rules state that you must give the give way boat room to keep clear when you alter course. The give way boat is ONLY obligated to react to the movement of your boat, and not to all of the yelling you might be doing.
    Sure, that doesn't mean I don't indulge in a bit of "keep up!" hails on the start line, but they don't mean anything under the rules and I don't bother mentioning them in any protest. I only mention the helm movements and timings. They're more of a warning to the other boat that you think they are not keeping clear as they should, and if they don't do something about it the next word out of my mouth might be "protest".
    You never know, I might be right!

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Posts
    216

    Default Re: Hailing & the new rules

    Quote Originally Posted by Daydream believer View Post
    The point of my question being that under the rules total silence seems to be acceptable.
    Seems to me that is at odds with need to avoid a collision & requirement to give another yacht room to keep clear if one does not state its intention in such a situation
    My guess is that the logic runs something like " the rules are clear and you shouldnt need shouting at to follow them. If you dont follow the rules and someone wishes to protest you, they are obliged to give you warning but if they dont wish to protest you then they dont need to do anything. As for room to tack, sure you have to give that room but it cannot always be obvious when the other boat needs you to do something. So they have to tell you."

    In short you only have to hail when either the timing of something is not obvious or when an action is optional. When the rules are quite clear you are expected to follow them without need to be told to do so.
    Last edited by howard easton; 13-02-17 at 10:23.

  8. #18

    Default Re: Hailing & the new rules

    "flaming" is correct that only two hails are mandatory under the rules ("protest" and "room to tack"), but other hails may be seen as efforts to avoid contact under rule 14.

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