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  1. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    S.W. France
    Posts
    7,819

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    You might look at the water based poxy coatings. I use Resoltech Re 1010. First coat is 1:1:1 resin/hardner/water. Second coat halve the water, third, just the resin and hardner. Goes on like milk with a toller, then clears and sets. Very easy to see where you have coated and seals extremely well. My little double ender had the three coats 11 yrs ago and is kept under cover. Only just giving her a paint scheme now.

    As for 'lifting' I would fancy a marine railway. Except that you might be on it for quite a while.

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Hayling Island
    Posts
    18

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    There is a very good book called "The boat repair manual" by George Buchanan, a must get if you don't have it already.
    I have used roof underlay from TP as an alternative to canvas. Can it be used to stick btw the planks?, it's rot proof breathable waterproof .

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Southampton
    Posts
    473

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    Quote Originally Posted by DownWest View Post
    You might look at the water based poxy coatings. I use Resoltech Re 1010. First coat is 1:1:1 resin/hardner/water. Second coat halve the water, third, just the resin and hardner. Goes on like milk with a toller, then clears and sets. Very easy to see where you have coated and seals extremely well. My little double ender had the three coats 11 yrs ago and is kept under cover. Only just giving her a paint scheme now.

    As for 'lifting' I would fancy a marine railway. Except that you might be on it for quite a while.
    Traditional boat supplies seem to stock it, quite a bit cheaper than CPES.

    I'd prefer getting it out on a slip, unfortunately I don't know of one in the Southampton area that has the associated equipment to get it out and blocked off.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pells View Post
    There is a very good book called "The boat repair manual" by George Buchanan, a must get if you don't have it already.
    I have used roof underlay from TP as an alternative to canvas. Can it be used to stick btw the planks?, it's rot proof breathable waterproof .
    Tyvek, great idea, I hadn't thought of it. It's also highly chemical resistant so should be OK being exposed to linseed oil. I've ordered a copy of that book, I have half a dozen similar books but none of them go into much detail about double diagonal and none have any suggestions about how it might be improved with modern materials.
    Jouet Golif 'Aljonic'

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    South of France.
    Posts
    4,173

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    How about the boat building training school, or whatever it's called, at Portsmouth dockyard? Hugo Andrae took his old family boat there and it came back like new. I imagine you pay for the materials and apprentices do the work.
    _______________________

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Colwell Bay
    Posts
    5,694

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    Quote Originally Posted by PotatoNavigator View Post
    Thanks for the replies.

    I've come to the conclusion it's going to be better to get the boat out and do a proper repair rather than experimenting with various bodges.

    I never wanted to go down the epoxy route for the reasons above, and it looks like using a PU sealant as a bedding compound, whilst it would allow the flex is going to have the same result of making future repairs very difficult. My current thinking therefore is a traditional style repair, but replacing some of the materials with more modern alternatives. The plan looks something like this:[LIST=1]
    1. Remove outer layer of planking
    2. Coat the inner planking with CPES or other epoxy instead of shellac
    3. Layer of fabric and white lead emulsion, PU coated Polyester instead of calico
    4. Seal new outer planking in epoxy to stabilise and increase durability
    5. Refasten outer planking in traditional way

    .
    Surely the calico is cotton, and it works because the fibres absorb water and swell up? what would your proposed polyester cloth be bringing to the party?

    I see two options. Upside down, all planks off, complete replanking job with epoxy.

    Or, outer planks off, traditional materials, planks back on.

    On the BMPT forum a few years back was a guy called Magic Fingers, he ran the boatyard that MTB102 trust bought, he did quite a few double diag repairs. He's be good to seek advice from.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Apr 2018
    Location
    Hayling Island
    Posts
    18

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    Quote Originally Posted by burgundyben View Post
    Surely the calico is cotton, and it works because the fibres absorb water and swell up? what would your proposed polyester cloth be bringing to the party?

    I see two options. Upside down, all planks off, complete replanking job with epoxy.

    Or, outer planks off, traditional materials, planks back on.

    On the BMPT forum a few years back was a guy called Magic Fingers, he ran the boatyard that MTB102 trust bought, he did quite a few double diag repairs. He's be good to seek advice from.
    I wondered the exact same thing but Calico soacked in boiled linseed oil would already be swollen and full? And why is the oil boiled?

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Jun 2015
    Posts
    1,135

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    Quote Originally Posted by Pells View Post
    I wondered the exact same thing but Calico soacked in boiled linseed oil would already be swollen and full? And why is the oil boiled?
    BOILED LINSEED OIL. Boiled Linseed Oil is used to give a mellow, patinated finish to new or stripped bare interior wood. It is a superior quality oil, similar to Raw Linseed, but has had hot air passed through it to improve drying times.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Southampton
    Posts
    473

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    Quote Originally Posted by burgundyben View Post
    Surely the calico is cotton, and it works because the fibres absorb water and swell up? what would your proposed polyester cloth be bringing to the party?
    .
    Cotton in white Lead has a very short life span. Considering the amount of cost and effort involved, I'm trying to come up with something that won't have rotted away in 10 years leaving me in the same position. I'm fairly convinced the synthetic fabric will work OK, the only thing I'm left wondering is if there will still be benefit to 'soaking' it in white lead or if there might be a better bedding material, tar of some sort perhaps.

    Quote Originally Posted by Pells View Post
    I wondered the exact same thing but Calico soacked in boiled linseed oil would already be swollen and full? And why is the oil boiled?
    I thought raw was preferred to keep it from drying as long as possible?
    Jouet Golif 'Aljonic'

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Colwell Bay
    Posts
    5,694

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    I came back to this thread to post because I recalled SpudNav wanting to put the boat on a slipway rather than lift (very commendable), so I scanned through the pages but can't see that now...anyway...

    I stumbled across this http://woodenshiprepairs.co.uk/index.php/news/ its in Cowes and I live in Cowes but didn't know!

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Sep 2015
    Location
    Southampton
    Posts
    473

    Default Re: Double Diagonal Topside Seams

    Quote Originally Posted by burgundyben View Post
    I came back to this thread to post because I recalled SpudNav wanting to put the boat on a slipway rather than lift (very commendable), so I scanned through the pages but can't see that now...anyway...

    I stumbled across this http://woodenshiprepairs.co.uk/index.php/news/ its in Cowes and I live in Cowes but didn't know!
    I think it might be a bit pricey to stay on their slip whilst I replace the topsides! Useful to know about though for smaller jobs in the future, thanks.

    Did you see my previous reply about the synthetic fabric? I'm thinking if I used something like tyvek, it won't need to swell in order to seal since it is inherently waterproof, so the inner planking should be protected long term. I have a concern about the longevity of the white lead emulsion between the fabric and the outer layer, since the fabric won't swell it might lead to water being trapped behind the outer planking. I'm not sure if this could happen, but assuming it could, would tar be a better for bedding than white lead, or is there no risk of the white lead being 'washed away' if the fabric cannot rot?
    Jouet Golif 'Aljonic'

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