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Thread: Steelboats

  1. #731
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
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    Default Re: Steelboats

    Quote Originally Posted by john_morris_uk View Post
    Even if I was sailing a steel boat I wouldn’t do it.

    It’s a stupid suggestion.

    It must be a bit difficult for Brent to keep making his phantasmagorical claims about the superiority of steel with so many people citing examples of GRP boats happily surviving collisions.

    The truth is that surviving collision with rock, reef or ship etc is not the only measure of whether a boat is fit for purpose but it seems to be the completely dominant one in his arguments.
    Along with over 350,00 miles of trouble free ocean cruising, with excellent passage times, zero deck leaks of any kind, zero thru hull problems of any kind, handrails you can vang a main to, or tie a staysail sheet to, hatches as watertight as a lid on a pressure cooker, mooring bits that never pull out,a windvane for under $50, anchor winch for under $75, in new custom boats ,for a fraction the cost of a new, custom plastic boat. The list goes on.
    Last edited by Brent Swain; 10-02-19 at 00:28.

  2. #732
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    Default Re: Steelboats

    Quote Originally Posted by PeteCooper View Post
    You actually believe that people should take you on in a demolition derby? As I said in a demolition derby all contestants are damaged. Why would any sane person want that?
    I believe the only thing which would be damaged on my boat would be a bent bow pulpit, easily repaired in an hour, with my onboard welder. Maybe not even that, as it would collide with a standard, thin walled ""Yotti tinfoil"" one, as on most plastic boats.
    The point is not the derby, it is demonstrating how little real confidence critics have in the truth of their postings.

  3. #733
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    Oct 2010
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    Default Re: Steelboats

    Quote Originally Posted by A1Sailor View Post
    Did you see the video of the yacht notsinking off Cowes? Perhaps she sank after the clip ended...
    Great to see that empty weekend boats can survive that. Different story with a 36 footer with 6,000 lbs of gear and personal effects aboard .
    My 36 takes 1,250 lbs to put her down an inch. Some have risen 6 inches when the owner moved all his stuff off. That is dead weight ,contributing nothing to strength, but greatly to inertia. That kind of dead weight in this boat would have caused her to shatter, and sink.
    Sleavins and others found that out, the hard way.
    Last edited by Brent Swain; 10-02-19 at 16:01.

  4. #734
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    Oct 2010
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    Default Re: Steelboats

    Quote Originally Posted by bbg View Post
    Too bad for you. I'm telling the truth.

    I know it doesn't fit with your prejudice that anyone venturing offshore in GRP is doomed to certain death, but it is true. Freighter hit him, boat was dismasted but not holed. To paraphrase you:
    It proves a GRP boat can survive a hull speed T-boning, without any leaks, period!

    http://www.histoiredeshalfs.com/Hist...0Minis/797.htm
    No one said "Certain death."" You are making up another ""straw man"" arguement, which no one else is making , so you can claim victory.
    Plastic can survive a lot of abuse if done well ( rarely done, and very expensive).Steel just has much better odds.
    Yes, tiny boats are much tougher for their size ( Law of mechanical similitude).

  5. #735
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    Oct 2010
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    Default Re: Steelboats

    The South BC coast is littered with plastic hulls with big holes in them.

  6. #736
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    Dec 2010
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    South Oxfordshire, Gosport and Wellington New Zealand.
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    Default Re: Steelboats

    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
    Great to see that empty weekend boats can survive that. Different story with a 36 footer with 6,000 lbs of gear and personal effects aboard .
    My 36 takes 11,500 lbs to put her down an inch. Some have risen 6 inches when the owner moved all his stuff off. That is dead weight ,contributing nothing to strength, but greatly to inertia. That kind of dead weight in this boat would have caused her to shatter, and sink.
    Sleavins and others found that out, the hard way.
    Another non scientific pronouncement from Mr Empirical.

    Is he squirming now he has seen GRP being given grief? Suggesting that because it was a race boat without 6,000 lbs of crap inside it survived?

    Get a life Brent-GRP as used in boats is very unlikely to " Shatter ". It can be pierced, it can be dented in the act of being pierced. It can separate at joints. But shattering-that is about the last thing it is likely to do.

    I actually know one of the guy's who was on board at the time.

    Very embarrassed about it he was too............................................... ......

  7. #737
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    Jun 2018
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    174

    Default Re: Steelboats

    I think his posts have effectively shattered what little credibility he may have retained in some quarters.

    The man is simply unable to recognise facts or reality. He is the Canadian sailing equivalent of “ the mad cat lady”
    TBH the “ah but, no but, yeah but” floundering defence of the untenable position he has got himself into is getting uncomfortable to watch. He has demonstrated he knows nothing about GRP and even less about logic and deductive reasoning.

  8. #738
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,278

    Default Re: Steelboats

    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
    Plastic can survive a lot of abuse if done well ( rarely done, and very expensive).Steel just has much better odds.
    Yes, tiny boats are much tougher for their size ( Law of mechanical similitude).
    Quote Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
    Great to see that empty weekend boats can survive that. Different story with a 36 footer with 6,000 lbs of gear and personal effects aboard .
    My 36 takes 11,500 lbs to put her down an inch. Some have risen 6 inches when the owner moved all his stuff off. That is dead weight ,contributing nothing to strength, but greatly to inertia. That kind of dead weight in this boat would have caused her to shatter, and sink.
    We got stuck on the stability calcs but this should be easier. The principle of dynamic similitude is indeed useful here, as is the principle of Archimedes. A 36’ GRP boat is a similar shape to yours, so should displace the same quantity of water and lower itself a similar distance following the addition of the same load. No?

    Turning to Archimedes; your 36’ boat will have a LWL of around 31’ or 9.5m? Its average waterline beam will be around 5’ 6” or thereabouts, i.e. 1.65m? So its waterline cross section will be something like 15.7 square meters (9.5m x 1.65m).

    11,500lbs is 5.2 tonnes, which Archimedes tells us should push the vessel down 33cm (5.2/15.7), i.e. around 13”.

    Now I understand hull shape will reduce that a bit, but to just 1” at the waterline?
    Last edited by dom; 10-02-19 at 08:21.

  9. #739
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    Oct 2012
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    Southminster, essex
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    8,996

    Default Re: Steelboats

    Dom
    Calcs are wrong
    You forgot that he is siting on a reef
    It is all down to the fact that my wife does not understand me !!

  10. #740
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    Dec 2010
    Location
    South Oxfordshire, Gosport and Wellington New Zealand.
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    Default Re: Steelboats

    Quote Originally Posted by dom View Post
    We got stuck on the stability calcs but this should be easier. The principle of dynamic similitude is indeed useful here, as is the principle of Archimedes. A 36 GRP boat is a similar shape to yours, so should displace the same quantity of water and lower itself a similar distance following the addition of the same load. No?

    Turning to Archimedes; your 36 boat will have a LWL of around 31 or 9.5m? Its average waterline beam will be around 5 6 or thereabouts, i.e. 1.65m? So its waterline cross section will be something like 15.7 square meters (9.5m x 1.65m).

    11,500lbs is 5.2 tonnes, which Archimedes tells us should push the vessel down 33cm (5.2/15.7), i.e. around 13.

    Now I understand hull shape will reduce that a bit, but to just 1 at the waterline?
    NO,NO,NO- You must be wrong! Like all the other boat designers who use calculations to ensure their boats are safe.

    Brent told us all his boat only lifts one inch when he takes 11,500 lbs out of her, and as we know, he is always right.........................

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