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  1. #21
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Posts
    650

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by JumbleDuck View Post
    The tourist boats from Fionnphort to Staffa have a ... robust ... approach to any yachts anchored in Bull Hole. In contrast, the boats running from the pontoons at Ulva Ferry could not be more courteous and considerate.
    -------turus mara from ulva run by a polite and generous family----i used to work for them

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jul 2002
    Location
    Farnham, Surrey
    Posts
    20,854

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by awol View Post
    Oh, to have the prescience to recognise the intentions of the other vessel so early. No wonder they call us WAFIs!
    Quote Originally Posted by GHA View Post
    Disagree, changing course early to keep well clear when it's obvious the other vessel isn't complying with the irpcs is good seamanship and good common sense and isn't..
    If only I had the telepathy necessary to work out what the other vessels intentions are so far away...

    The rules say 'stand on' and so I stand on until it's obvious that the other person's not taking a blind bit of notice of the rules and I alter to avoid a collision. What I think of the other person for being such a plonker is another. matter.
    Semper aliud

  3. #23
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Scotland
    Posts
    2,042

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by awol View Post
    Oh, to have the prescience to recognise the intentions of the other vessel so early. No wonder they call us WAFIs!
    It's a bit sad that a vessel whose crew must have been professionally trained fail to understand IRPCS. I usually expect better behavior from commercial vessels, however the option I leave myself is the "turn away" if they get too close, even when I'm stand-on.. I'd love to have a loud enough horn to blow the required blast! (or even 5 of!!)

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Hopefully somewhere warm
    Posts
    9,105

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by john_morris_uk View Post
    The rules say 'stand on' and so I stand on until it's obvious that the other person's not taking a blind bit of notice of the rules and I alter to avoid a collision. What I think of the other person for being such a plonker is another. matter.
    Exactly. Don't push it to the last moment just to prove a point.
    Last edited by GHA; 07-05-19 at 20:40.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
    Posts
    2,131

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    You could always make a VHF call to 'Long Room' on Ch14, where staff will be monitoring and recording movements on quite effective radar, and raise the matter of 'hazardous behaviour.' I am assured by one of those who know that they would welcome more such reports MADE AT THE TIME.

    https://www.gov.uk/government/groups/qhm-plymouth

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    East Coast
    Posts
    1,649

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by greeny View Post
    Whatever action you chose to take to avoid the collision or near miss", can and should be reported to the relevant authorities should it not. The incident can then be investigated and the guilty dealt with as required. If you walk away and turn the other cheek you may not be in a position to take effective action to avoid collision next time it happens. They will keep doing what they are doing until they are told the error of their ways by someone in authority.
    Of course to make any report stick you will need evidence, photographs, ais track etc would be useful.
    Everyone can make a mistake and I'm not suggesting that we as boaters go reporting every minor incident but these people sound as they are persistent offenders and should be dealt with.
    Have to agree with this. Many but not all small commercial craft seem to take action in line with the OP's experience.

    I have had similar experiences on the East Coast often under sail whilst they are under engine. I have found phoning their business premises at a later date not only clears the air but at least you can hear their side . Surely doing nothing helps no one.
    It is never too late to have a happy childhood. Buy a boat.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    3,199

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by john_morris_uk View Post
    Just wave your thanks for his complying and ignore the scowls. Life is too short to worry about these things.

    Life on the water.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    3,199

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by greeny View Post
    Whatever action you chose to take to avoid the collision or near miss", can and should be reported to the relevant authorities should it not. The incident can then be investigated and the guilty dealt with as required. If you walk away and turn the other cheek you may not be in a position to take effective action to avoid collision next time it happens. They will keep doing what they are doing until they are told the error of their ways by someone in authority.
    Of course to make any report stick you will need evidence, photographs, ais track etc would be useful.
    Everyone can make a mistake and I'm not suggesting that we as boaters go reporting every minor incident but these people sound as they are persistent offenders and should be dealt with.
    What was reportable here?
    Tour boat operator was grumpy?

    I donít disagree with reporting. Just donít think this particular interaction, was reportable or requiring investigation.
    The tour boat reportedly, took action as required by a give way vessel to avoid collision.
    Maybe not quite as early as the OP on the stand on vessel would have liked.

    Not late enough for the OP on the stand on vessel to have become concerned enough to signal his doubts or take action by his manoeuvre.

    In my opinion.
    If I become concerned enough.
    If I make a sound signal or radio call.
    If this results in positive response. I am happy. Situation was resolved. Nothing to report.

    If I find the above doesnít work. Or Iím not happy with the response.

    I take action as required. If this involves action by me as a stand on vessel to avoid a give way vessel apparently not taking the required action.
    This would be reportable.

    I have made few reports about such incidents. Usually there is little point beyond reduction of later paperwork.
    There was a boat
    I couldn't see itís name
    I couldnít see itís number.
    I have no means of identifying it.
    I had to action as stand on vessel by operating astern propulsion the unidentifiable vessel passed safely ahead.

    Day date time position.

    The authority thanks me, files report and does nothing.

    As a commercial vessel it is probably identifiable and the authorityís will probably contact both vessels asking about the event. Most of which will be treated in a similar way to a MAIB report. left to individual companies to investigate and report back.

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    17

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Wherever possible I always give other vessels a wide berth. There is no reason to get too close.

    That said, there are always incidents where for one reason or another this does not happen.

    In this instance the ferry operator could see me for some time (minutes) and as I was on a steady course, there was no reason for him to drive like a "white van man" and potentially cause a collision. I was monitoring his movements as he came from my port quarter and I was confident that I had the ability to manoeuvre to avoid a collision if necessary; noting not doing so is also a breach of COLREGs. As the stand on vessel, if I stop "standing on" and start doing something else, the other vessel could easily get confused as to my intentions (assuming the skipper is competent, which in this case he clearly wasn't). So there is a balance point as to when you stop "standing on" and take evasive action. There was lots of room and time for the ferry to alter course; we are only talking a circa 5 degrees course change on his part, and or minor reduction in his speed to easily clear my stern; and there was nothing behind me!

    This type of behaviour does happen, and if it was amateur boaters, you could put it down to inexperience etc. But this was a commercial operator who should know better and needlessly put two vessels and the lives of those onboard at risk.

    In hindsight I should have reported it; but to be honest I didn't get the name of the vessel, (small red hulled, white superstructure, passenger carry boat, with open bow, circa 10-15m length I'd guess) so if anybody knows it, I'll happily drop the harbour master a line.

    This type of behaviour, especially from commercial operator is inexcusable (after all we are talking about a failure to comply with probably the most basic COLREG.) should not be tolerated and should be called out and reported at every occurrence. (Which I will do next time.) If they are that incompetent their qualifications and suitability to hold them has to be questioned!

  10. #30
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Portugal
    Posts
    533

    Default Re: What do they teach people these days!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Uricanejack View Post
    What was reportable here?
    Tour boat operator was grumpy?

    I don’t disagree with reporting. Just don’t think this particular interaction, was reportable or requiring investigation.
    The tour boat reportedly, took action as required by a give way vessel to avoid collision.
    Maybe not quite as early as the OP on the stand on vessel would have liked.

    Not late enough for the OP on the stand on vessel to have become concerned enough to signal his doubts or take action by his manoeuvre.

    In my opinion.
    If I become concerned enough.
    If I make a sound signal or radio call.
    If this results in positive response. I am happy. Situation was resolved. Nothing to report.

    If I find the above doesn’t work. Or I’m not happy with the response.

    I take action as required. If this involves action by me as a stand on vessel to avoid a give way vessel apparently not taking the required action.
    This would be reportable.

    I have made few reports about such incidents. Usually there is little point beyond reduction of later paperwork.
    There was a boat
    I couldn't see it’s name
    I couldn’t see it’s number.
    I have no means of identifying it.
    I had to action as stand on vessel by operating astern propulsion the unidentifiable vessel passed safely ahead.

    Day date time position.

    The authority thanks me, files report and does nothing.

    As a commercial vessel it is probably identifiable and the authority’s will probably contact both vessels asking about the event. Most of which will be treated in a similar way to a MAIB report. left to individual companies to investigate and report back.

    Your choice.

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