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  1. #71
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
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    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    [QUOTE=Neeves;6868733]
    Quote Originally Posted by Zing View Post
    Why do you think doubling weight, doubles hold.....
    But forgot doubling weight doubles hold - dreamland.
    Jonathan
    Deary me. Between your hostile retorts and JumbleDucks sarcasm it is getting to be a bit of a heated anchor war. I will defer to our colleague Noelex. I agree with his posts and he explains it much more thoroughly than I can.

  2. #72
    Join Date
    Nov 2016
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    2,467

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zing View Post
    ......but what does a cat weigh?
    I suspect that 'Neeves' cat weighs in at about 8 tons.... or is it 'tonnes'?

    It may be less, 'cos he has lightweight chain on board....

    Also, if there's a movement back towards Imperial Measures, then I look forward to 'chains, rods, perches, and roods'..... as well as pints!

  3. #73
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    East coast UK. Mostly. Sometimes the Philippines
    Posts
    9,393

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zing View Post
    Iím learning some nautical terms here like a Thames ton, which I was able to look up, but what does a cat weigh?
    I really hate the spill chequer on my iPhone. It thinks it knows better and Ďcorrectsí me without asking me first.

  4. #74
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
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    East coast UK. Mostly. Sometimes the Philippines
    Posts
    9,393

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by zoidberg View Post
    I suspect that 'Neeves' cat weighs in at about 8 tons.... or is it 'tonnes'?

    It may be less, 'cos he has lightweight chain on board....

    Also, if there's a movement back towards Imperial Measures, then I look forward to 'chains, rods, perches, and roods'..... as well as pints!
    I’m sure Dominic Cummings will be happy to provide these. Four rods make a chain, and indeed a cricket pitch, forty rods by four rods make an acre.

  5. #75
    Join Date
    Feb 2014
    Location
    The Northern Powerhouse
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    2,739

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by zoidberg View Post
    I suspect that 'Neeves' cat weighs in at about 8 tons.... or is it 'tonnes'?

    It may be less, 'cos he has lightweight chain on board....

    Also, if there's a movement back towards Imperial Measures, then I look forward to 'chains, rods, perches, and roods'..... as well as pints!
    JRM needs men like you in his office. Apply for a job.

  6. #76
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    East coast UK. Mostly. Sometimes the Philippines
    Posts
    9,393

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    I thought it might be interesting to see what the ancients had to say about anchors.

    One thing which needs pointing out is that we canít always anchor where they did, as moorings have proliferated, but at the same time we donít use the offshore anchorages, like the Downs and Dungeness, that they used.

    Often, their gear seems a bit light.

    Also, certainly well into the sixties, they were anchoring and getting under way under sail. No backing down under power to set the anchor .
    Last edited by Minn; 08-08-19 at 13:10.

  7. #77
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Greenwich
    Posts
    7,331

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    A 10 percent increase in holding ability could easily halve your risk of dragging. It all depends where the anchor/boat combination is along the curve of probability of high gusts in your cruisng area.

    Think of that like the right hand half of a bell curve with likelihood of a gust as the Y axis and holding power needed to withstand it as the X axis. Starting from a zero knot gust then at first all anchor weights hold then it become a linear relationship then at some point as you get near the tail of the bell curve a tiny increase in holding power will move your likelihood of dragging from a once a year gust to a once every two years likely gust. What happens as you get into the far end of the tail is interesting but hopefully academic.

    I guess my point is that the relationship between the holding power between two anchor weights is not the main factor is assessing risk reduction.

  8. #78
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Atlantic
    Posts
    20,468

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Minn View Post
    I thought it might be interesting to see what the ancients had to say about anchors.

    One thing which needs pointing out is that we can’t always anchor where they did, as moorings have proliferated, but at the same time we don’t use the offshore anchorages, like the Downs and Dungeness, that they used.

    Often, their gear seems a bit light.

    Also, certainly well into the sixties, they were anchoring and getting under way under sail. No backing down under power to set the anchor .
    One of the pleasures of teaching the RYA courses is having the excuse- and the 'person' opwer to do exactly that.

    Its introduction really at Day Skipper, but they should all get a go. For the more advanced Coastal practical and the not a course but brilliant primer, preperation for Coastal and Offshore exams, theres loads that can be done.

    Especially short tacking into an anchorage, letting go and using backed sails to set. Almost as good for keeping sharp as sailing alongside a berth.

  9. #79
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Location
    SW Scotland
    Posts
    19,408

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zing View Post
    1 size. It nearly doubled my safety factor. Two sizes wound nearly quadruple it. More would be better, but I have I feel enough and the next size is too heavy.
    Hmm. What safety factor do you think Rocna built in to their recommendation in the first place?

    As to recommenced sizing, I do not believe the Lewmar CQR sizing is correct or comparable to others. And you are wrong to think it can be relied on in my view.
    Have I ever said that I think it can be relied upon? For what it's worth, my boat is midway along their recommendation for 20lb but I have a 25lb, which is slightly oversized in their view.

    There is no standard or openness in respect of how calculation are done. The sizing by Rocna and others has a greater safety factor built in already as evidenced by their greater performance on a like for like recommended size.
    Hmm, again. Nothing personal, you understand, but saying that you trust Rocna while simultaneously buying a bigger size than they recommend seems a bit contradictory. But if you're happy with the decision and it works for you, why not?
    "Seamen are always wanting to do things the proper way; and I like to do them my way."

  10. #80
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Location
    Hopefully somewhere warm
    Posts
    9,394

    Default Re: Deliberately starting an anchor thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by noelex View Post
    Personally, I do not mind which data you want to trust.


    Cruise long enough and I suspect a lot of people will eventually take onboard that your capacity to predict the future or have any significant control over a lot of the day to day future can be limited. So shoving the odds a bit more in your favour when it all goes a bit crazy in the anchorage is very much a *good thing* !! If buying a new anchor then going a bit bigger just seems so obvious with no downside other than a few quid.

    Strange that a few get so annoyed about this.......

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