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Thread: Mooring options

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
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    Wales
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    926

    Default Re: Mooring options

    It's currently Sale Pending https://www.yachtworld.co.uk/boats/1...-mk-1-3235436/ (Not me)

    Pending a survey (+seatrial?) and a review myself I too would have been considering it. (It was on my watch list).

    Surprisingly it only knocks of £400 after 10 years (this factors in maintenance, boat cost, berthing). I'm sure there will be some extra savings to be had, but they're not where it counts :|. I hadn't run the budget on this boat previously, my previous assumption was a 36ft (11m) that was about £15,000 (not a real boat, but an estimation), probably why the price difference is not as great has figured.
    Last edited by Luminescent; 30-08-19 at 17:59.

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
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    World wide.
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    300

    Default Re: Mooring options

    If the sale falls through it could be a good buy, I know it was rerigged recently.

  3. #33
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    Apr 2019
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    Wales
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    Default Re: Mooring options

    Potentially, I still have to figure out how to get those maintenance costs down >.<; I've had to revise some maintenance costs up due to new calculations (haul out charges). Though I've reduced the refit and misc budgets to what I think is the tolerance. Unfortunately berthing fees have averaged out higher than I'd like >.>

    Maintenance currently stands at 20% of boat value per year, mooring and insurance, 18%.
    Last edited by Luminescent; 30-08-19 at 19:06.

  4. #34
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    Apr 2019
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    Default Re: Mooring options

    Quote Originally Posted by Luminescent View Post
    Potentially, I still have to figure out how to get those maintenance costs down >.<; I've had to revise some maintenance costs up due to new calculations (haul out charges). Though I've reduced the refit and misc budgets to what I think is the tolerance. Unfortunately berthing fees have averaged out higher than I'd like >.>

    Maintenance currently stands at 20% of boat value per year, mooring and insurance, 18%.
    I don't understand how you came to 20% of the boat value each year in maintenance. That's a lot of maintenance. You don't need to haul out every year or antifoul for that matter. Service the engine yourself, sails should be ok for a few years for you want to do. What are you like with a paintbrush? Insurance is a couple of hundred pounds a year. So all you are left with is mooring fee's. I have never understood this 20% maintenance thing. On a 100k boat that's 20k

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    stourport:
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    386

    Default Re: Mooring options

    No disrespect to anyone, but breaking things down spreadsheet style aint good.. boats generally have problems no one forsees, basically you just gotta get a boat and enjoy it! If numbers are on your mind it won't work out too well for you.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Wales
    Posts
    926

    Default Re: Mooring options

    Erk: As this thread is no longer about Mooring. I'm going to thank everyone for their time and their contributions it has helped me factor in certain amounts and of course the advice around maintenance has come much earlier than anticipated but again a welcome and structural input. Every post has been valuable and has changed something about the process I'm going through. If there's anything else anyone would like to add please let me know.

    -------


    The 20% is just what it came to. So it comes on average to £3500~ per annum (including the price of the boat) I would still expect it to be high with a bigger boat due to the complexity mind you. There are two schools of thought with anti-foul, in camp 1: who cares, in camp 2: you're ruining your boat if you don't do it every year. I plan to haul out as little as I can, but once a year seems to the limit (depending on how much you're using the boat), but then I'd also use that time to carry out other tasks should they be necessary. Sails should last me a bit longer (according to some sites up to 15 years for good quality sails) but I'm also factoring in things like rips and minor repairs. I'll point to post #21 for more details likewise there's some stuff that I'd rather not do myself if I can at all help it and I'd sooner pay someone else to do if I can.

    The mooring fees are again over £2,000 per annum (some cheaper, most more expensive and mud berthing seems to divide yachties more than brexit).

    Solitaire11, I complete get where you're coming from. Unfortunately I don't want to spend £15,000 on a boat (closer to £22,000 in the first year) only for two years later to realize I can't sustain the outlay.

    Still, it sounds like the extra budget for maintenance might be beefier than needed and if so that means I can reinvest either into the boat or into something else that makes life fun (like high interest savings accounts... I never claimed to be exciting).

    If anyone thinks they can do yachting cheaper, I'd be interested to know how they work it out. It seems to me most people actually put more in than they realize they're doing.
    Last edited by Luminescent; 30-08-19 at 22:06. Reason: Thread is off topic and probably needs closing.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Location
    Bristol
    Posts
    561

    Default Re: Mooring options

    my tuppence: I have lived solo, quite comfortably on a 32 ft, old boat for a year. It's not as comfortable as an AWB for living but much more so for sailing (out in a gale is no problem).

    For my present boat I looked at 35-36ft but the spreadsheet (for my needs) pointed out that costs nearly doubled for that extra length. So I'm back to a 32ft one. I have head clerance in all but the forepeak.

    In this one I have been to spain for three months, scotland for three months and milford have for two weeks! Next year we are going to the baltic for 4 months and may overwinter her there to come back the next year. SWMBO likes the cruising life but is not a sailor so I am still basically a solo sailor. I can do just about everything on the boat by myself with ease - not so easy on a 40ft-er.

    She's in bristol harbour so only 15 mins walk, away for easy maintenance/getting her right for me. That means I only go sailng for 3 months at a time because the bristol channel takes a lot of concentration and I get bored of the same places ( aweekend to cardiff and back).

    So far I've calculated that she's cost about £800 per week of sailing (not including when I sell her) and that will come down to less than £500 after the next two seasons. If I kept her in a marina that would be much higher.

    I'm not saying do what I do - we all have differing needs/wants from boats. If you want to sail reasonably cheaply and get experience then you could do what my brother did. From his YM theory course he got together with other students and they chartered boats out of progressively more challenging places. They split the costs and rotated the roles and evaluated their performances. Learnt a lot and had fun while avoiding the hassle of ownership. They were liked by the charter companies because they kept coming back back and they also provided a defects list each time. Got discounts and perks too.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Bristol
    Posts
    967

    Default Re: Mooring options

    Luminescent: I think that managing a 40ft boat on your own in Locks, or Swinging moorings would be a nightmare and absolutely impossible on Trot Moorings except in the calmest of weathers. Fine for going round world when you only moor a few times but that is hardly the Bristol Channel. There is a good reason why 35ft is normal maximum in these waters and I wouldn't even want anything that big as it would simply stop me getting to many of the fine creeks harbours around these coasts.

    Furthermore if you have never owned a boat before I will hazard that the first you buy will not prove to be the right fit so sellability is a consideration, and you can expect to lose half of what you paid for it, so mortgaging/borrowing up to the hilt is not advisable.

    My costs for a 31ft are £200pa mooring plus about £1800 a year maintenance, insurance and liftout, and that include new sails engine and rigging in the last 10 years, but as an engineer I do most other routine work as relief from computerised bureaucratised day to day job
    A boat is for going places

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Bristol
    Posts
    4,262

    Default Re: Mooring options

    Starting with a 40 foot boat is an interesting concept! I started with 22, progressed to 33 and now sail a 36 foot boat, two handed. We are both yacht masters and have sailed to the Baltic and twice across the Atlantic, since 2016. What mistaken rational makes 40 feet necessary? I thought my heavy 33 foot Westerly was good for the Bristol channel and trips to France and Ireland.
    Allan
    Sailblogs.com search Brilliant with Hilary and Allan as crew. Password Bristol.

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Location
    Wales
    Posts
    926

    Default Re: Mooring options

    Quote Originally Posted by oldmanofthehills View Post
    Luminescent: I think that managing a 40ft boat on your own in Locks, or Swinging moorings would be a nightmare and absolutely impossible on Trot Moorings except in the calmest of weathers. Fine for going round world when you only moor a few times but that is hardly the Bristol Channel. There is a good reason why 35ft is normal maximum in these waters and I wouldn't even want anything that big as it would simply stop me getting to many of the fine creeks harbours around these coasts.

    Furthermore if you have never owned a boat before I will hazard that the first you buy will not prove to be the right fit so sellability is a consideration, and you can expect to lose half of what you paid for it, so mortgaging/borrowing up to the hilt is not advisable.

    My costs for a 31ft are £200pa mooring plus about £1800 a year maintenance, insurance and liftout, and that include new sails engine and rigging in the last 10 years, but as an engineer I do most other routine work as relief from computerised bureaucratised day to day job
    First up 40ft is effectively thrown out, simply not the budget! However I don't mind something slightly larger than 35ft if it happens to be within my price range. Trial by fire, it's the only way to learn (exaggeration much!). Generally the boats that I'm looking at are within the 30-35ft range now. I really wouldn't want to go smaller... however... that is a big however, that may all change as sailing experience and familiarity with boats grows.

    Re finance, I appreciate the advice and normally I'd agree, but my circumstances are a bit different to most who choose to buy on credit. It works out cheaper for me to do so.

    Many thanks for the costs. I'm hoping to keep my maintenance costs lower but I guess it ultimately depends, I can likely stretch to about £2,500 a year maintenance costs if necessary (I'll be thinking long and hard about 'need' and 'want'). There's a lot of learning to be done! If the engine goes, first thing I'm buying is a sculling oar... (now, sculling a 40ft'r...XD).

    Quote Originally Posted by Allan View Post
    Starting with a 40 foot boat is an interesting concept! I started with 22, progressed to 33 and now sail a 36 foot boat, two handed. We are both yacht masters and have sailed to the Baltic and twice across the Atlantic, since 2016. What mistaken rational makes 40 feet necessary? I thought my heavy 33 foot Westerly was good for the Bristol channel and trips to France and Ireland.
    Allan
    *cough* Newb *cough*. There are a couple of things for me that make a 22 impractical but that may obviously change (see above). The rational comes largely from being a newb (check post count, you can see me a mile off!) and advice about what would be roughly needed for what I have in the back of my mind. I do appreciate the advice as well and the information about the 33 foot Westerly. Albeit finding out how heavy a boat is.....well, tricky as not listed on most adverts. I'm generally of the theory, that the larger the better, I'm not fussed about speed (so we can wipe out the racers in general), but I do want steady and well, depends on which sailor you listen to as to which boat is right. Some like their 22ft'rs, others declare them unfit to sail anything but the village pond!

    Cheers both for your guidance, highly valued. Thankfully it seems I've already adapted to a lot of the raised points based on previous posters.

    ... speaking of which...

    In short, there are three options for me I see, Dale Yacht Club (if they'll have me), Cardiff Yacht Club (if they'll have me) or Swansea. These are roughly the best value for what they offer. Though I'll keep any thoughts in mind. (I don't need frills, so I can afford to disregard them).
    Last edited by Luminescent; 12-09-19 at 18:45.

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