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  1. #61
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
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    208

    Default Re: colregs question

    Exactly. So the OP was curious as to know what were the rules to follow, without getting all stressed by it.

    As both a racer and cruiser I've been on both sides. Seen a racing boat approaching, and volunterily getting out of their way as I'm merely pottering and they could be going for a win.

    Conversely I've been racing and have come across a cruiser 'in my way'. If the helm is looking at me, I've been known to shout in a friendly way 'I'm in a race, do you mind if.....' and added what I want to happen, whether it's me getting too close in a normal situation or asking them to alter course. As I do it in a friendly tone 9 times out of 10 the cruiser complies. I don't think they do it because I'm lucky!

  2. #62
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Boat Orwell - Me Norwich
    Posts
    8,456

    Default Re: colregs question

    Quote Originally Posted by davidlhill View Post
    If the colregs were followed by racers a windward start in a force 6 could never happen, as there is a constant risk of collision. Approaching a windward mark? Ditto. A dinghy on port dipping the transom of a starboard tack boat shouldn't happen according to the colgregsd as well before I commence the dip I should have borne or tacked away! As such racers know (or should do!) the RRS, and in the main they coincide with the colregs (I believe) and as such that's all they usually bother to learn.
    Does that imply they are generally unaware that their interactions with non-racing craft are governed by the Colregs, and not the Racing Rules?

  3. #63
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    208

    Default Re: colregs question

    Obviously I can only speak of my experience, but yes I'd say so definitely in the case of dinghy racers. In 20 years of racing various classes on the sea where I encountered non-racing yachts I've never heard a colreg conversation post race. Or to be more accurate, they may have been aware of the existence of the colregs but certainly wouldn't know them.

    In my yacht racing experience when I skippered I took the view non-racing yachts were basically hazards so never went near them, and if I had to always assumed they didn't know the rules.

  4. #64
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Atlantic
    Posts
    21,622

    Default Re: colregs question

    Quote Originally Posted by davidlhill View Post

    In my yacht racing experience when I skippered I took the view non-racing yachts were basically hazards so never went near them, and if I had to always assumed they didn't know the rules.
    Me too. Sailing up close to cruising yachts and dipping round behind them at speed is stupid really. No doubt this will cause the odd squeal but I saw it happen countless times. Look for people who call other boat users numpties or muppets and suchlike and you will see the type of person who does that. They are probably not very good at driving home either....

  5. #65
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    5,630

    Default Re: colregs question

    Quote Originally Posted by davidlhill View Post
    Obviously I can only speak of my experience, but yes I'd say so definitely in the case of dinghy racers. In 20 years of racing various classes on the sea where I encountered non-racing yachts I've never heard a colreg conversation post race. Or to be more accurate, they may have been aware of the existence of the colregs but certainly wouldn't know them.
    I too haven't heard a colregs conversation after a dinghy race. Though I think the question of dinghies mixing with cruising vessels is more complicated. I for example was sailing in Brittany this summer and came upon a ton of 505s milling around in front of the port. A charming Frenchman beckoned me over, so I blew the main, tacked and furled the jib. He maneuvered his Dragon to within about 2m alongside, said, "Welcome to Douarnenez!", explained the course, and off I went. And if one thinks about it, in advance of the preparatory signals most dinghies just mill around and are sensible, as indeed are most yachts in a big fleet.

    Similarly if cruising the Solent on a race day while sailing on stbd across a fleet on port, 99% of boats will do the sensible thing, slow, then cross clearly in a suitable gap causing minimal disruption. Just like we cross a road. One can of course barge across, but it causes stress at best.

    Not to forget that the colregs tend to completely fall over in a busy situation where multiple boats are acquiring and losing stand-on, give-way status every couple of seconds. And yet, common sense aka seamanship seems to do a tremendously good job of avoiding needless contacts

    Edit: good racing boats are rarely mouthy, or shouty; rather fast, calm, firm, and friendly. But they may come surprisingly close!
    Last edited by dom; 13-09-19 at 10:36.

  6. #66
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    208

    Default Re: colregs question

    Quote Originally Posted by dom View Post

    Edit: good racing boats are rarely mouthy, or shouty; rather fast, calm, firm, and friendly. But they may come surprisingly close!
    Spot on.
    And totally agree with your Stb approach to a racing fleet on Port. If I bear away a fraction I can enjoy watching the race for a bit, and it reduces stress all round.

  7. #67
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Posts
    38,825

    Default Re: colregs question

    Quote Originally Posted by davidlhill View Post
    Obviously I can only speak of my experience, but yes I'd say so definitely in the case of dinghy racers. In 20 years of racing various classes on the sea where I encountered non-racing yachts I've never heard a colreg conversation post race. Or to be more accurate, they may have been aware of the existence of the colregs but certainly wouldn't know them.
    ....
    I think you are both arrogant and wrong to be certain that dinghy racers won't know colregs.
    Very often on the sea, dinghy racers also sail other boats.
    My club has dinghy racers who know colregs much better than many cruiser owners I have met.
    Even a lot of the youngsters have been sailing on family boats, or in some cases, working on family boats, for many years and are quite familiar with both rules and customs.
    A lot of these kids have far better situational awareness than some yachtowners who live inland and seem to think as if they are driving a car along a road.

  8. #68
    Join Date
    Mar 2017
    Posts
    208

    Default Re: colregs question

    As soon as I saw your username I knew how you'd respond.

    Arrogant? I clearly stated 'I can only speak from my experience'.

    From racing dinghies for over 20 years I know we have fabulous situational awareness - that's why on a crowded start line there aren't multiple collisions, and why avoiding one does not lead to instigating a second. Ive raced Merlins, Isos, Wayfarers and Solos to Worlds so not inexperienced.

    Still, I will take your word that at your club dinghy sailors learn the colregs as a matter of course.

  9. #69
    Join Date
    May 2018
    Posts
    25

    Default Re: colregs question

    Here is a colreg/RRS question for you all....


    Two boats are sailing downwind on a converging course. One is on starboard, and the other is on port. If the racing rules of sailing apply, then the starboard yacht has right of way. If the ColRegs apply, then the port vessel has right of way, as the other vessel is the give way vessel.

    Without any racing going on, the colregs obviously apply. However when yachts are racing at night, or more importantly around sunset, what do you do when two boats come together?
    ~ Better a bad day on the water than a good day in the office ~

  10. #70
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Posts
    25,225

    Default Re: colregs question

    Quote Originally Posted by c.buck View Post
    Here is a colreg/RRS question for you all....


    Two boats are sailing downwind on a converging course. One is on starboard, and the other is on port. If the racing rules of sailing apply, then the starboard yacht has right of way. If the ColRegs apply, then the port vessel has right of way, as the other vessel is the give way vessel.

    Without any racing going on, the colregs obviously apply. However when yachts are racing at night, or more importantly around sunset, what do you do when two boats come together?
    In offshore racing colregs apply during hours of darkness - I guess the cut off is when you can no longer tell if the other boat is racing or not

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