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Thread: RNLI

  1. #31
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by scotty123 View Post
    Why do the ones on TV have RNLI on them then?
    When the current increase in cross channel activity started the RNLI were used routinely to intercept the boats but that soon got changed. Now they are used for "distress" calls only whatever the description of the boat involved. In bad weather that might mean a small inflatable overloaded with migrants or a yacht running late for a dinner date but not just a run out to intercept because HM cutter Vigilant is too busy.

  2. #32
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles Wader View Post
    When the current increase in cross channel activity started the RNLI were used routinely to intercept the boats but that soon got changed. Now they are used for "distress" calls only whatever the description of the boat involved. In bad weather that might mean a small inflatable overloaded with migrants or a yacht running late for a dinner date but not just a run out to intercept because HM cutter Vigilant is too busy.
    Do the migrant RIBs have vhf?

  3. #33
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by graham View Post
    We as leisure sailors can pick and choose when we go to sea .Crews of" all weather lifeboats" go whenever they are needed. The clue is in the name.

    If you are sending people out in extreme conditions they need the very best boats and equipment available.Which is probably why this cost cutting exercise seems to be concentrating on slimming down support staff rather than down grading the standard of boats and equipment.
    The basic fallacy of this argument is to equate the cost of a boat with its efficacy. RNLI boats are dear because it took them 13 years to develop the Shannon, they reinvented the wheel by bringing production in-house and they could not manage their product development with the result that the boat and carriage turned out to be nearly twice as expensive as had been announced a few years earlier.

    I believe the French boats have a better basic design - as evidenced by the fact that their hull design is now used on boats all over the world including in the Thames estuary where, as pilot boats, they are making fuel savings of £50000 per year per boat compared with earlier designs.

    Berthon who first built the Shannon said they were going to market it elsewhere. I wonder how many they sold?.
    Last edited by Sybarite; 12-09-19 at 15:49.

  4. #34
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by scotty123 View Post
    Do the migrant RIBs have vhf?
    Is that relevant to what constitutes a distress call for the RNLI?

  5. #35
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles Wader View Post
    Is that relevant to what constitutes a distress call for the RNLI?
    From the migrants RIB, yes.

  6. #36
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by CLB View Post
    I guess many will be surprised by how many people are on the payroll of a 'volunteer' organisation. I am also surprised by their 'lack of funds' statement. I thought they were loaded.
    Here's some additional background from two years ago :

    Default Re: Has the RNLI lost the plot?

    Posted by thecommander

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    The RNLI is a World Class organisation and I'm incredibility proud of it!! The volunteers, the fund raisers, the crew etc - nothing like it outside the British Isles and Ireland.
    If I die leaving no family behind, I'll happily leave them everything in my will!!


    Posted by Sybarite

    Unlike you I have looked in detail at the two organizations, RNLI and SNSM, over the last ten years.

    What began as an idle speculation about seeing how the two compared, my interest was sparked originally when I saw that the RNLI had more people earning more than £50k per year than the total number of employees in the SNSM

    Then I saw that the SNSM operated with roughly 10% of the RNLI operating costs year after year. It should be noted that the number of shouts and saves are roughly in the same ball-park.

    The basic budget difference is that the work done by paid staff in the UK is done by volunteers in France. In France the largest group of paid staff represent mechanics in the service centres.

    I then looked at the boats. In terms of size the French boats were being produced at roughly one third the cost of RNLI boats. Many RNLI defenders got their knickers in a twist telling me that there was no comparison between the boats, that I knew nothing, that their boats out-performed the French boats, that the French boats didn't use jets. etc etc.

    Well these criticisms didn't stand up to a common sense scrutiny.

    The Shannon boat took 13 years between conception and delivery - which included a significant redesign of the hull halfway through. (They allowed themselves 3 years to redesign the hull....) All those development costs had to go somewhere but did not justify a threefold price differential.

    The SNSM's latest AWB the CTT (canot tout temps) is bigger, faster and has a greater range that the RNLI equivalents. (It took about 3-4 years to develop and deliver) It is also worthwhile watching videos of both and see which one passes more easily in high seas. The CTT's top speed is as high if not higher than the RNLI equivalent but does so with half the HP. That says something about hull design.

    However the SNSM did not try to reinvent the wheel. They used outside naval architects and yards which had previous experience in building life boats and pilot boats. Thus they did not saddle themselves with an enormous fixed cost structure that the RNLI have undertaken. If there is a future downturn in donations - and who knows what might happen post Brexit - that may prove a millstone around their neck.

    My interest in the situation has led me to having discussions with directors of the SNSM as well as with its President. So as to having lost the plot I think I am a little bit better informed than you - unless you can demonstrate the contrary.

    Read more at http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread...OuFXlYWdRMI.99


    Posted by Sybarite

    Just some quick observations on the accounts :

    Total income is up from £186.1m to £194.9m.

    Of this income, over 2/3 (66.9%) is due to legacies which increased from £118.5m to £130.5m.

    However donations are down by £5m - £56.5m to £51.5m.

    This shows that the viability of the RNLI is entirely dependent upon people remembering it in their wills.

    Despite the fall in generosity of the public - hard times on the way? - staff numbers are considerably increased (FTEs) 1476 to 1608.

    This for me is a major criticism of the RNLI management. 9% reduction in public donations : 9% increase in staff.

    Of the sums raised £17.7m was spent on new boats (or £13.7 net after disposal of old boats) or 9% of revenues maintaining the general percentage that has existed over the last decade.

    The year showed a deficit on results of £31.8m mainly because a major adjustment for future pension liabilities had to be made. This totalled £91.9m or 5 times the amount spent on boats.

    Therefore global funds/reserves did not approach the £800m that I was expecting but fell from £745.3 to £712.6m.

    Read more at http://www.ybw.com/forums/showthread...OuFXlYWdRMI.99
    Last edited by Sybarite; 12-09-19 at 19:51.

  7. #37
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by scotty123 View Post
    Do the migrant RIBs have vhf?
    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles Wader View Post
    Is that relevant to what constitutes a distress call for the RNLI?
    Quote Originally Posted by scotty123 View Post
    From the migrants RIB, yes.
    The RNLI is tasked to attend by the coastguard and they decide what constitutes a distress call. Whether that call comes from a boat full of migrants with a vhf or from a report from a passing ship or from anywhere else is not really relevant to the issue I would have thought. The Dover strait is a busy old place and calls come from lots of sources.

  8. #38
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by Biggles Wader View Post
    The RNLI is tasked to attend by the coastguard and they decide what constitutes a distress call. Whether that call comes from a boat full of migrants with a vhf or from a report from a passing ship or from anywhere else is not really relevant to the issue I would have thought. The Dover strait is a busy old place and calls come from lots of sources.
    So why, if that easily spotted & reported, are they getting to UK coastline, surely they will have been seen much before the TSS/shipping lanes on the French side & then stopped/rescued?

  9. #39
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    Default Re: RNLI

    Quote Originally Posted by scotty123 View Post
    So why, if that easily spotted & reported, are they getting to UK coastline, surely they will have been seen much before the TSS/shipping lanes on the French side & then stopped/rescued?
    Ask Boris Johnson, he's in charge, but I suspect the reason is he does not want to put up taxes to pay for the many more ships and staff it would need, his priority is to build a bridge to Northern Ireland

  10. #40
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    Default Re: RNLI

    For a starting point Iím amazed that there are a 130 staff at head office that the RNLI have now worked out they donít need, how did it ever get to the point that there were so many nonproductive staff anyway.
    Secondly I really hope that some of the 130 include the P.C. Snowflakes that were responsible for the suspension of active crew members for various harmless activities.

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