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  1. #51
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
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    Boat - Clyde, Home - Overlooking the Tamar
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    4,084

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    the "well heeled" are "well heeled" because they have always looked at the price on the pump in all its various forms!

    rob

  2. #52
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    k up your daughters
    Posts
    3,341

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    You seem to be very blinkered, with your size of boat there are numerous other more efficient and slightly smaller if necessary boats that you could buy, why would people give up and not just get a boat that suits? All new buyers who are buying knowing the costs will have no problem, as for someone who buys a boat without researching and gets a surprise at the fuel costs, well more the fool he is.

    Boating will go on, it will be upset for a year or so with the wrong people in the wrong boats but will settlle IMHO. Those left holding big uneconomical boats will be hardest hit, the smart ones are out of the market now with their cash safely put away watching and waiting, easier to get back at where they were if nothing changes or at a level they feel comfortable with, not left with a boat rotting unused on a swinging mooring.

    I do feel sorry for those that will be affected, but they have had the good times, it has been well documented and broadcast, no excuses for anyone who has been in denial until now. I am a petrol boater and have paid my taxes, why should a diesel boater have it any different, who has stood up for me shouting about reducing the tax on petrol for boats? The party is over, be prepared for reality or take the consequences.

  3. #53
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    k up your daughters
    Posts
    3,341

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    I agree, but why have they not 'unscrewed themselves', it has been common knowledge for a long time, too many heads in the sand for too long. Anyone caught out now who will be in real trouble has brought it on themselves for not taking action earlier, there are a lot who have and are not faced with this problem.

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Boat - Clyde, Home - Overlooking the Tamar
    Posts
    4,084

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    If you read Gludy's post carefully you will see that he has taken action to mitigate the effect by buying in to a semi-displacement hull. Your implied criticism seems unfair.

  5. #55
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    k up your daughters
    Posts
    3,341

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    I am talking about the general view he takes, he has taken the right step, but others have not. But as I have said and most people realise there are a lot of 'heads in the sand' out there still [img]/forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif[/img]

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Brecon, Wales
    Posts
    7,165

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    I find your views a little harsh, if not selfish.

    Hardest hit will be the typical cruising power boater with a 30 foot something that he loves and struggles to keep. If the entire market had sold out to convert to cash the prices would have dropped like a stone - many are trapped and live in hope that it will never happen.

    its not easy for them to try and sell up - stay out of their hobby for 2 years or more then hope to buy in - real world factors such as they losing their marina berth would matter to them but that does not seem to bother you at all.

    "why should a diesel boater have it any different, who has stood up for me shouting about reducing the tax on petrol for boats?"

    Well that a nice selfish position:-

    1. The chances of petrol being reduced just for boats is zilch. To have argued such a case would never have resulted in anything but damage to boating.

    2. You bought into a petrol boat knowing the costs.

    3. You had a choice of buying into diesel and chose not to.

    When did you buy your boat?

    What is your boat?

    Where is it berthed?

    You seem to be handing down these harsh judgements so it would help if we could understand a little of your boating experience etc.
    Paul
    St Francis 50 Cat
    My Multihull Forum

  7. #57
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Sussex
    Posts
    1,580

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    Agreed the marginal cost of a trip is largely the fuel cost, plus food, beer and visitor's berthing fees, albeit these are discretionary to a point!!

    I switched from petrol to S24 diesel this year (long sad expensive story my petrol boat, including it testing the engine bay fire extinguishers fitted the week before... they worked!) and I will upgrade to a larger boat once the fuel situation is known. £100 of fuel takes me over 150 miles at 25 knots in the S24, and as a proportion of my budgeted annual costs doesn't figure all that highly. It's huge fun too!

    I have a friend with a Phantom 38 who's obviously not happy with the prospect of double fuel costs, in his case, but will dig deeper, maybe use the boat a little less, but will carry on with it. His Phantom is financed, so the percentage increase on his boating budget is not huge given his cruising usage.

    The impact on individuals will clearly vary immensely depending on their circumstances. Although the new boat market rumoured to be slow, (tho marine finance companies reporting record lending figures) there were plenty of people who appeared to be negotiating deals on new planing boats at SIBS.
    Adrian is searching for his next boat....

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Aug 2001
    Location
    Brecon, Wales
    Posts
    7,165

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation


    " I will upgrade to a larger boat once the fuel situation is known"

    Even you are making decisions based upon the result of the red issue. Your friend whilst not giving up boating will restrict his boating. These are natural adjustments by the users to the market change. Others will get out of boating all together, yet others will take their boats outside the UK - no more tax will be collected and our hobby will be hard hit.
    Paul
    St Francis 50 Cat
    My Multihull Forum

  9. #59
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    ked into poverty by children
    Posts
    8,517

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    Interesting to note from the news today that HMG will _not_ up the tax on aviation fuel, _and_ maintain it would have no environmental effect if they did.

    Now isn't than interesting. Something to do with holiday flyers votes I suspect:-)
    Two beers please, my friend is paying.

  10. #60
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Sussex
    Posts
    1,580

    Default Re: Does Red Diesel Issue = Rapid Diesel Vessel Depreciation

    Just like to point out I do support the campaign to keep red and am not indifferent to the outcome. In my first post I was making a specific point about a specific situation.

    I freely admit I'm taking advantage of my circumstances to minimse my downside, which is clearly a lot less than yours.

    On the main forum pages I see threads going up about the virtues of differing drive types on prospective 50' fly purchases and which new model of large planing boat to go for. This is among folk that know the red situation. I agree some people will be hit hard, will have to change their boating habits, will have to trade down in size, or that no more tax will be collected, but equally I don't subscribe to the "it'll be the end of large planing boats in the UK" theory.

    It'll not be nice for sure, but it'll not be the end of motor boating.

    As an aside - whilst wandering around SIBS on Sunday I was wondering if any of the UK manufacturers currently focused on planing boats were going to move into the SD market if red goes.
    Adrian is searching for his next boat....

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