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  1. #41

    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    I suspect that you are right but qualified so and the rule provides the qualification.

    I also think that such would be unlikely to eventuate in practice - for example and going to the extreme, a light with 6 degree sectors obscured only one degree apart all around (so only visible for 40 degrees or whatever it works out to be) certainly would not comply.

    So I suspect the expectation is a max of 6 degrees (and it is hard to imagine a reasonable situation where that could not be limited to one direction) but can be more than that if impractical to get the height, not means that one can have as many 6 degree sectors as one wishes.

    John
    <span style="color:blue">www.sailroom.co.uk</span>

  2. #42
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    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    <span style="color:black">Bu</span>gger - you beat me to it.

    'Tis amazing what one finds when one actually reads the col regs.
    --------------------
    "Artificial intelligence is no match for natural stupidity"
    Artificial Intelligence is no match for Natural Stupidity

  3. #43
    john_morris_uk is offline Registered User
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    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    [ QUOTE ]
    When you consider that aircraft large, small and worldwide have 'high-intensity strobing anti-collision lights' and that these co-exist with red/port and green/starboard lights without confusion, to 'see and be seen', it is hard to understand the IMO's reluctance to incorporate this new technology in the interests of our safety.

    [/ QUOTE ] There's no bouyage in the air. If we all took to using strobes all the time, the sea would become an even more confusing place.

    How can someone tell the difference (at a distance in murky weather) between your strobe and a N. Cardinal mark? Don't you think a white flare, or a high power torch might have done the same job? IMHO its not hard to see why this technology is not adopted in the interests of safety. There might conceivably be a place for a high power strobe for use in search and rescue operations, but for general use at sea or at anchor, please don't use them!
    Wishing things away is not effective.

  4. #44
    jenku's Avatar
    jenku is offline Registered User
    Location : Stockholm, Sweden
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    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    Oh no, not all of Europe. Sweden has the US rule also. And we don't need to show a cone while motorsailing with only mainsail up.

  5. #45
    bilbobaggins is offline Registered User
    Location : Grey Havens Marina - Elves pontoon
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    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    [ QUOTE ]
    If we all took to using strobes all the time, the sea would become an even more confusing place.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    It is not suggested that these be used 'all the time', John, only in circumstances of need to 'see and be seen'. It's perhaps a little disingenuous, and a 'reductio ad absurdum', to imply otherwise.

    And the observation that there is no buoyage in the air is irrelevant and misleading. Look above any major airport on a clear night, and one will see plenty of strobe lights, red and green running lights, landing lights, all over the sky..... The people driving those machines manage to avoid each other *because* they have high-visibility anti-collision lights, and they would not willingly do without them.

    I am well aware of Rule 36, ' If necessary to attract the attention of another vessel any vessel may make light or sound signals ....', and the specific prohibition therein relating to strobe lights. I refer also to Rule 2a, and seek to raise here a considered discussion of the relative merits of such devices, specifically to attract the attention of another 'RoC' vessel showing no sign of having seen oneself, and specifically to avoid a clearly-developing risk of collision.

    It has been the practice, for as long as I've been going near boats, to keep to hand a white flare or two, or a powerful spotlight, for use to help indicate presence when an approaching vessel shows no sign of having seen oneself, and a risk of collision exists. Many boats no longer carry white flares - I crewed on a recent Fastnet Race where the owner, when asked about the RORC 'mandatory' white flares prior to a night watch, replied "What do you want one of them for?" He was a member of RORC's Safety Committee. On another friend's boat, the white flare which lived for years on a shelf just inside the companionway crumbled to pieces when it was moved for access. On a dark night, crossing St George's Channel on the wind with a failed engine, we were overhauled at speed from the lee quarter by a Spanish fishing vessel. Our 'SeaMe' radar transponder device was functioning, as were our conventional lights, but this MFV remained steady on a collision course. Torches shone on sails and in his direction had no effect. When he got to about 200 yards, I operated a handheld strobe in the cockpit, and he sheered off within seconds. All of us were convinced that *only* the use of this device got his attention. On another occasion in a Channel winter gale, many years before, a Cornish lifeboat couldn't find us despite RT comms and GPS, due to the size of the breaking seas. They asked us to use a flare or illuminate, and I told them I'd use a strobe - which they saw within seconds.

    Those experiences suggest to me that there is merit in the devices' use, in wholly-appropriate circumstances, and that we should perhaps be querying, via the RYA and MCA, that part of Rule 36 referred to below. After all, the ColRegs do evolve with developing technology and need.

    [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

  6. #46
    Anonymous Guest

    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    You make the point well that in extremis white strobes could be valuable - one would hope to never need to deploy one, any more than one hopes to deploy a GPS EPIRB.

    To my mind they should be used when you consider yourself to be in 'grave and imminent danger' though unlike a 'mayday' you would not be requesting 'immediate assistance', only that others become aware of your position and behave accordingly.

  7. #47
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    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    [ QUOTE ]
    Oh no, not all of Europe. Sweden has the US rule also. And we don't need to show a cone while motorsailing with only mainsail up.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    Well that explains a lot. I noticed that no one in Sweden seems to use anchor lights, even in crowded anchorages, and I couldn't understand why. My boat didn't come with one, but after nearly getting run into by a motorboat when anchored (and rafted up next to a 40'er) I promptly fitted one.

  8. #48
    jenku's Avatar
    jenku is offline Registered User
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    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    I think the Swedish rule is because it almost never gets really dark up here during the summer. Still I agree there are times when they can be useful. I recently bought one of those garden lamps that do charge themselves via small solar panels during the day and automatically switch on when it gets dark. Anybody tried those on a boat?

  9. #49
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    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    I have seen those on a boat on a mooring in Saundersfoot.

    A good idea, but the light intensity was very low, probably only visidble from three hundred yards. It was also low on the boat, an anchor light does need to be up high(??) at least head height from the deck, and needs to be bright.

    Otherwise only blame yourself if things go bump in the night!!

  10. #50
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    Default Re: Anchor lights - risks of not showing correct lights

    Yes it hardly gets dark at all at the moment, but it does start getting darker towards the end of August when there can still be quite a few boats out on the Archipelago. Also, a lot of boats moor up to the rocks, so hitting one amounts to the same thing as crashing into the land.

    I'm sure a couple of people on here have mentioned using automatic solar lamps, and if the weather stays like this it would sure get plenty of power [img]/forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif[/img]

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