Location: Rural Nth Yorks - 2 miles from bus stop, 8 miles from station.
Posts: 3,073
Fit for purpose?
Early on Sunday morning I was tied up on a pontoon intending to take my daughter up the river to take some mud samples for her project.
The dinghy was tied to the stern of the boat, I climbed into the dinghy knelt at the pointy end while daughter passed a few bits and pieces down to me, nothing at all heavy.
I then sat on the inflatable thwart and moved to sit at the stern of the boat so as to start the outboard. I was sitting on the slatted floor, facing forward, and put my right hand on the starboard tube to ease myself a bit further aft. As I put some weight on my right hand the dinghy flipped completely over dunking me and the other contents in several metres of water.
Fortunately I had full waterproofs and an auto inflate life jacket on and 2 seconds later I was bobbing about gasping. Ultimately I was fished out by Tyne Pilots with support from Police, Fire and Ambulance, my daughter managed to persuade the Coastguard that a helicopter wasn't really necessary. Immense gratitude to all involved, Tyne Pilots especially.
But the point is can a dinghy that is so unstable be in any way fit to serve as the tender to a yacht?
Is there any stability standard for dinghys?
In no way was it even approaching being overloaded
My (considerable) body weight (16 stone) never went outside the outer part of the dinghy
There was some tide through the mooring but not that much - why should the thing flip over so easily.
No doubt someone will ask:
The thing is a Plastimo 3 man boat, bought a little over 2 years ago and only used previously on one occasion - by my daughter.
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If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
If your weight biased to one side lifted the other side a little bit and wind caught it?--
Ihave an Avon Redcrest and I am amazed how stable it is. I'm 13st and I can stsnd on one side tube (while steadying myself on gaurdwire) with little heeling effect. I think there's a bit of "surface tension" effect ---until wind gets under it!
If your weight biased to one side lifted the other side a little bit and wind caught it?--
Ihave an Avon Redcrest and I am amazed how stable it is. I'm 13st and I can stsnd on one side tube (while steadying myself on gaurdwire) with little heeling effect. I think there's a bit of "surface tension" effect ---until wind gets under it!
Early on Sunday morning I was tied up on a pontoon intending to take my daughter up the river to take some mud samples for her project.
The dinghy was tied to the stern of the boat, I climbed into the dinghy knelt at the pointy end while daughter passed a few bits and pieces down to me, nothing at all heavy.
I then sat on the inflatable thwart and moved to sit at the stern of the boat so as to start the outboard. I was sitting on the slatted floor, facing forward, and put my right hand on the starboard tube to ease myself a bit further aft. As I put some weight on my right hand the dinghy flipped completely over dunking me and the other contents in several metres of water.
Fortunately I had full waterproofs and an auto inflate life jacket on and 2 seconds later I was bobbing about gasping. Ultimately I was fished out by Tyne Pilots with support from Police, Fire and Ambulance, my daughter managed to persuade the Coastguard that a helicopter wasn't really necessary. Immense gratitude to all involved, Tyne Pilots especially.
But the point is can a dinghy that is so unstable be in any way fit to serve as the tender to a yacht?
Is there any stability standard for dinghys?
In no way was it even approaching being overloaded
My (considerable) body weight (16 stone) never went outside the outer part of the dinghy
There was some tide through the mooring but not that much - why should the thing flip over so easily.
No doubt someone will ask:
The thing is a Plastimo 3 man boat, bought a little over 2 years ago and only used previously on one occasion - by my daughter.
I was in my Seago 2.6 this summer in Barmouth, it was "normal" Barmouth, tied up to the hippo buoy, tide running like a bugger.
My mate was tied up by the stern to one of the temp buoys as well as by the bow line, we needed to untie his stern line so off I went in the dink. I tied up to the buoy and started to undo the stern line from the stbd front quarter, my mate shouted be careful with the current, I then realised that if i wasnt careful the current would go over the side of the dink and it would tip up as you have described! It was then that I realised also what maybe happened to the Harbour Master and his assistant a few years ago.
Not nice and a lesson learned!!
Stu
You have now (OK, actually small boats, not intended solely for racing, etc.)
If the tender was bought new in the last 10 years, or so, it should be CE marked which implies compliance with the relevant standards (*may* not be CE marked under the above directive if it is less than 2.5m long, but there will be some relevant directive). The OP's recourse is with the Trading Standards who police CE compliance (but I'm not sure if they know that).
I can't find the text of the relevant standards freely available, but the stability requirements are likely to be in line with the MCA requirements (not sure if they have a minimum length cut-off or not):
It might be worthwhile now to carry out a controlled experiment, by moving your weight around very slowly in the dinghy, and seeing what effect it has, and how tippy it becomes.
I have a lovely little 7'6" pram dinghy which most folk would say is definitely un-fit for purpose as it is so tippy - but because of its relatively narrow waterline beam it rows like a dream. And has very impressive dynamic stability while underway, a bit like a bicycle
A 15 stone pal wanted to 'have a go' in it - I told him to be careful and make sure he had his weight in the centre when his feet touched the bottom as he climbed down from his yacht, and next thing I knew he was in the water...... at least it was warm water in the Grenadines!
I suppose that some dinghies just have to be experimented with to find out what their limits are, rather than assuming that they will be fit for purpose for a 10 stone (or even 16 stone) crew member.
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So you found out that your dinghy obeys the laws of physics, and due to your inexperience you end up in the water, and it's the products' fault? Bah, sue 'em, I say.
If your weight biased to one side lifted the other side a little bit and wind caught it?--
Ihave an Avon Redcrest and I am amazed how stable it is. I'm 13st and I can stsnd on one side tube (while steadying myself on gaurdwire) with little heeling effect. I think there's a bit of "surface tension" effect ---until wind gets under it!
If only! Many moons ago in Torquay Harbour in number 1's ready to go to friends for dinner I was sitting in Avon Redstart, just to one side, holding top of pram, with daughter in it, to hand to wife on harbour wall steps. As I lifted the pram beyond the tubes the pram suddenly flipped. SWMBO luckily retrieved daughter and pram top but my number 1's were ruined and we were late for dinner! "Flipped" was not amongst the words I expleted!
Location: Rural Nth Yorks - 2 miles from bus stop, 8 miles from station.
Posts: 3,073
"So you found out that your dinghy obeys the laws of physics, and due to your inexperience you end up in the water, and it's the products' fault? Bah, sue 'em, I say."
I ask a sensible question and there has to be someone who turns offensive about.
If you can't help why not just keep quiet?
__________________
If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
The smaller Plastimos have smaller diameter tubes than the larger sizes so inevitably are less stable. As others have noted (perhaps rather too bluntly) 16 stone on a small tube is likely to result in a tip! Suggest if you are concerned about suitability of use in your circumstances you do a bit of experimentation in calm, preferrably warm water.
In my experience a 2.4m inflatable is the minimum for general purpose use as a tender.
Hmm Tide running, 16 stone plus the weight of the engine at the far end of a small inflatable, with no vee bottom or solid floor and no weight at the other end to counter it. It's not entirely surprising.
I ask a sensible question and there has to be someone who turns offensive about.
If you can't help why not just keep quiet?
I am helping. You were wondering whether the product is fit for purpose, I am suggesting, like many other posters, that the cause of the dunking might not lie with the product.
You could start a poll, given the circumstances, was the capsize caused by
a) inexperienced use of a dinghy
b) mass of the user vs point of balance in a form stable vessel
c) product is not fit for purpose
I will hartely agree that a Plastimo 3 man dingy might not be the correct tender for a 16 stone man, at least not without a few trials. Indeed, with a 15ft RIB, this would never have happened.
You misplaced your weight in a small dinghy and ended up in the water. It is no big deal, it happened to a lot of us (incl yours truly), be glad that there are no pictures of the event.
Fit for purpose?
Wind?
(OK, actually small boats, not intended solely for racing, etc.)
)
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