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Tranona
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Reged: 10/11/2007
Posts: 1466
Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK
      14/05/2008 11:21

Just because official bodies hold a particular view, does not mean that it is either right nor open to challenge. My views are based on the evidence - all in the public domain.

Thankfully we have not got to the stage where carrying a raft is a legal requirement as in France, and I think this is because the official bodies know that it could never be justified.

Just in case you think that I am anti lferaft I suggest you read the fishing boat accident reports from MAIB where there is overwhelming evidence that lives could be saved if hydrostatically released liferafts were used. However the situation is very different as these boats go out in weather when you and I are tucked up in front of the fire. The boats also have a tendency to turn over unexpectedly because of snagging the bottom or loads shifting etc. Once again all in the reports. Recently the Spanish government has made it compulsory for fishermen to wear lifejackets in an attempt to reduce the death toll and I understand proposing to withold compensation if the deceased was not wearing one.

In part this argument is philosophical. Do we base our legislation/advice/official body opinion on evidence or individual and collective belief. For the last several centuries since the enlightenment have collectively favoured the evidence based approach through scientific method. There is a danger that we are moving away from this - we can see it in the debates on road safety, medical care and the environment to name just a few.

In this narrow case that we are looking at (liferafts in yachts) we have very clear evidence, well documented. There are so few cases that statistics are inappropriate, but the method of analysis is to look at each individual case for lessons and possible themes. This gives us three primary causes of foundering (coinditions, collision and structural failure) and 3 lessons on liferafts - they work OK in organised evacuations (but may even then fail to operate); they are less effective in deployment in extreme conditions and they can be unstable and difficult to board. There is no evidence to show that they might be effective in situations like Ouzo, other than in a theoretical sense, and we will probably never know until there is a similar incident where a hydrostatic released raft was used.

In the meantime set your boundaries of sailing within your own perceived risk envelope and enjoy it!

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Subject Posted by Posted on
* "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK RGH 12/05/2008 17:03
. * * RNLI Sea Safety contribution Peter_Chennell   16/05/2008 11:56
. * * Re: RNLI Sea Safety contribution Fireball   16/05/2008 12:04
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK nct1   14/05/2008 12:47
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   14/05/2008 15:39
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK nct1   14/05/2008 18:26
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   14/05/2008 19:46
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK nct1   15/05/2008 12:59
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   15/05/2008 13:23
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK nct1   15/05/2008 14:33
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   15/05/2008 14:55
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Sailfree   15/05/2008 16:43
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Captainslarty   15/05/2008 13:35
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   15/05/2008 16:55
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   15/05/2008 14:07
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   15/05/2008 17:27
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK jonjo   15/05/2008 21:15
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK WindFinder   15/05/2008 21:23
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK WindFinder   15/05/2008 18:44
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   15/05/2008 22:28
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   16/05/2008 09:03
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   16/05/2008 09:28
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Chrusty1   16/05/2008 09:11
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Moonfire   15/05/2008 19:36
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK WindFinder   15/05/2008 20:03
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Moonfire   15/05/2008 20:16
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Sailfree   15/05/2008 18:02
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   15/05/2008 14:27
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   15/05/2008 14:38
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   15/05/2008 14:58
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Chrusty1   15/05/2008 13:45
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Chrusty1   15/05/2008 13:33
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Moonfire   14/05/2008 20:49
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   15/05/2008 09:23
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK WindFinder   14/05/2008 23:14
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Moonfire   15/05/2008 09:21
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   14/05/2008 22:43
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Moonfire   15/05/2008 09:34
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   15/05/2008 06:43
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   15/05/2008 07:48
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Sailfree   14/05/2008 19:39
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Sailfree   14/05/2008 16:54
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK jordanbasset   14/05/2008 17:00
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   14/05/2008 16:03
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   14/05/2008 16:49
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   15/05/2008 08:49
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK jordanbasset   15/05/2008 11:12
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   15/05/2008 09:00
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   15/05/2008 09:07
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   15/05/2008 09:40
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   15/05/2008 10:18
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   15/05/2008 11:15
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   15/05/2008 12:16
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK QuestGirl   13/05/2008 17:08
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK jack_sparrow   13/05/2008 15:37
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   13/05/2008 16:11
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK WindFinder   13/05/2008 17:51
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   13/05/2008 23:47
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DogWatch   14/05/2008 00:31
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   13/05/2008 19:39
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   13/05/2008 23:45
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DogWatch   14/05/2008 00:30
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   14/05/2008 08:19
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Login_name   14/05/2008 17:33
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   14/05/2008 11:21
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   14/05/2008 18:24
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK jordanbasset   13/05/2008 20:39
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   13/05/2008 23:40
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   14/05/2008 06:22
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 16:19
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 15:45
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DavenHelen   13/05/2008 16:02
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 16:15
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Nicki_Crutchfield   13/05/2008 01:18
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK csail   13/05/2008 09:49
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK steve_clayton   12/05/2008 19:41
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK BlueChip   12/05/2008 19:16
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK RGH   12/05/2008 20:26
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Searush   12/05/2008 22:20
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK LadyInBed   16/05/2008 13:10
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Login_name   13/05/2008 00:11
. * * exposure homa   12/05/2008 18:48
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK michael_w   12/05/2008 18:45
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   12/05/2008 18:37
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Chrusty1   12/05/2008 18:50
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK RGH   13/05/2008 10:06
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   13/05/2008 09:58
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   13/05/2008 11:53
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 11:59
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   13/05/2008 12:16
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Sailfree   13/05/2008 13:08
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DJE   13/05/2008 12:06
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Chrusty1   13/05/2008 10:41
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 10:22
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   13/05/2008 10:46
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 11:05
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   13/05/2008 13:27
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   13/05/2008 14:07
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   13/05/2008 15:20
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 15:28
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Chrusty1   13/05/2008 13:46
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 13:38
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alant   13/05/2008 15:11
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK DogWatch   13/05/2008 15:58
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 15:59
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   13/05/2008 15:24
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 15:23
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK stevebrassett   13/05/2008 15:37
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Clifford_Pope   13/05/2008 13:50
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Fireball   13/05/2008 14:06
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Kevin_Mac   13/05/2008 10:30
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Chrusty1   13/05/2008 10:34
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK homa   12/05/2008 18:23
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Moonfire   12/05/2008 18:35
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   12/05/2008 18:48
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Moonfire   12/05/2008 19:01
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   12/05/2008 23:44
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK peterb   13/05/2008 00:16
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   13/05/2008 00:30
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK mikehibb   12/05/2008 19:16
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK David_Jersey   12/05/2008 17:45
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Tranona   12/05/2008 18:07
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Login_name   12/05/2008 18:12
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK SAWDOC   12/05/2008 20:21
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Gludy   12/05/2008 18:15
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Login_name   12/05/2008 17:33
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK alan17   12/05/2008 17:42
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Login_name   12/05/2008 18:06
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Morgana   12/05/2008 18:12
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Chrusty1   12/05/2008 18:22
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK Kermudjon   12/05/2008 17:14
. * * Re: "Liferaft" is it needed for coastal cruising in UK bendyone   12/05/2008 17:06

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